Last edited by joasis; 09-19-2009 at 07:29 AM.
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I'm sure in a lot of regards Wal-Mart has been disgraceful. I also think they're the largest so it makes since they have the most lawsuits from employees and the most scorned vendors, etc. But, I would bet there are 6 vendors they have made filthy rich for every one they have upended.
As a businessman I think the Wal-Mart story is amazing. People hate on WalMart because they're huge and they destroy local mom-and-pop businesses. We forget that 50 years ago Wal-Mart was a mom-and-pop shop called Walton's. The difference between WalMart and all the competition is just that Wal-Mart did/does it better. Sam was the man.
I'm sure in a lot of regards Wal-Mart has been disgraceful. I also think they're the largest so it makes since they have the most lawsuits from employees and the most scorned vendors, etc. But, I would bet there are 6 vendors they have made filthy rich for every one they have upended.
As a businessman I think the Wal-Mart story is amazing. People hate on WalMart because they're huge and they destroy local mom-and-pop businesses. We forget that 50 years ago Wal-Mart was a mom-and-pop shop called Walton's. The difference between WalMart and all the competition is just that Wal-Mart did/does it better. Sam was the man.
I can guarantee you that 9 out of 10 contractors no matter how poor of business men they are, run a better quality business when it comes to customer service, quality of product, timely delivery, treatment and respect for employees, treatment of customers and treatment of vendors then Walmart does.
Sam Walton was a penny pinching cheap ass bastard. He created a mega penny pinching cheap ass company that abuses employees, vendors and communities all in the name of allowing stupid American consumers the ability to buy a 12 pack of toilet paper for $3.99 instead of $4.75.
Now if you want to get down to the nitty gritty with comparisons based on size, look up the 2nd largest company in the USA, which is Exxon and compare the lawsuits against it by it's employees to Walmarts by it's employees and you'll not even be in the same universe. Look up the 3rd, 4th and 5th. Nobody has a record like Walmart.
Wal-mart does get lawsuits left right and center. I know a few people who work in the wal-mart down the street and each one of them has tried to sue them for the most ridiculous things. Like rouge trollies hitting them as they walk to their cars, Stuff falling from shelfs as they are stacking them. I just think it's the kind of person that wal-mart has work for them more than wal-mart being the big bad company. I find the people i know who work in Lowe's to be a lot better quality of worker than the Lowe's next door
Last edited by BCConstruction; 09-14-2009 at 09:02 PM.
Wal-mart does get lawsuits left right and center. I know a few people who work in the wal-mart down the street and each one of them has tried to sue them for the most ridiculous things. Like rouge trollies hitting them as they walk to their cars, Stuff falling from shelfs as they are stacking them. I just think it's the kind of person that wal-mart has work for them more than wal-mart being the big bad company. I find the people i know who work in Lowe's to be a lot better quality of worker than the Lowe's next door
Walmart gets sued by its employee for labor violations - sex discrimination, over-time, minimum wage, civil-rights, time-shaving...ect
In a recent audit of 128 Walmart stores, they found 127 were out of compliance with labor laws. Whoops.
A lawsuit against Walmart in 2004 had 40,000 plaintifs (all walmart employees or former employee) 40,000!
Now, you'd think that would be some sort of world record huh? Nope, that's nothing for Walmart.
The largest civil rights case ever brought against a company - Guess who?
Walmart - 1.6 million people!
Last Dec they finally determined they should look to a bulk settlement to a bunch of lawsuits that had been draggin on for years that Walmart had no hope of winning, so Walmart reached a settlement to settle 63 class action lawsuits against it all at once for 650 million dollars. $650,000,000.00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCConstruction
Wal-mart does get lawsuits left right and center. I know a few people who work in the wal-mart down the street and each one of them has tried to sue them for the most ridiculous things. Like rouge trollies hitting them as they walk to their cars, Stuff falling from shelfs as they are stacking them. I just think it's the kind of person that wal-mart has work for them more than wal-mart being the big bad company. I find the people i know who work in Lowe's to be a lot better quality of worker than the Lowe's next door
It couldn't be that they have
a proven record of screwing employees?
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I feel bad for people who live in a town where Wal Mart is all they have to get their stuff. I see this quite a bit in the South.
Thankfully we only have small Wal Marts here. Still plenty of regional chains and mom and pops. Moscow still has a vibrant downtown ad does Pullman. Lewiston, not so much.
The city of Pullman recently lost a long, multi-year battle to keep Wal Mart out. Residents signed petitions by the thousands to keep Wal Mart from opening a store. Big protests, protracted legal battles, lots of city council meetings. In the end Wal mart outspent the city of Pullman on attorneys and they're getting their store. When the decision was announced there were hundreds, maybe thousands, of people outside city hall in tears.
It's amazing that a corporation can force itself upon a city and a population that does not want it's presence. Wal Mart is an unstoppable force.
Is it just me or does anyone else feel dirty when they shop at Wal Mart?
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When I read the sh&t they pull on employees and time shaving, making them work for free. And then the rest of the Crapmart story begins how they get infrastructure for free with the promise of jobs, then when the city is about to get their cut from Crapmart they move 1 mile outside city limits. The problem is people are too stupid and fat to begin the Crapmart way.
Colorado has successfully kept Crapmart out of several cities and now they pretty much build them on the highways.
As I said I am not defending walmart. That said a lot of the information available by searching Google comes from special interest groups. I would not consider that information 100% reliable. They use the 3 S's business model (this is taught in business classes on the college level for those who don't know) and implement it much more efficiently then most. Are some of their tactics questionable and unethical? Absolutely.
The companies that get in bed with them are well aware of what they are getting into. They are not able able to bully all the companies who's products they carry. The general consensus among companies that opt to conduct business with walmart is either they do well or walmart takes advantage of them. It is split pretty evenly down the middle. Walmart views its relationship with its suppliers as a partnership and does provide assistance to those companies to help them lower production costs. Mike this is where you are correct on many of your statements as one of those "steps" may include outsourcing or moving production plants overseas. They do account for a significant amount of sales (up to 20%) for many companies and that does deter some companies from walking away from what they consider to be an unfair shake.
Walmart does use this knowledge to "renegotiate" and has been known to set the price the will pay for products suppliers. They are credited with flipping the supply chain backwards due to their approach. Again those who get in bed with them are aware of all this and make the decision that it is better for their company to do this. Walmart has not been successful in it's approach with all companies that it deals with as some are to large and have enough other outlets to distribute their products through that walmart is just another tool, not the tool.
As to the high amount of law suits; while this statement is true it is a blanket statement. Walmart does have a high percentage of lawsuits. A very high percentage of those suits can be attributed to "frivolous" suits by customers such as the furby incident, people slipping in the store, injuries while doing things such as exercise equipment in the store. There have also been suits based on incidents in walmart parking lots that go from security related to carts bumping into cars, carts bumping into people, people bumping into people, weather related accidents and so on. These can probably be attributed to the target audience of walmart. This has led to walmart taking an unusual strategy of fighting almost everything in court. This stratigy has helped to reduce the number of suits over the years. Remember the usual business tactic with regards to lawsuits is not one of right or wrong but one of economics. If costs less to settle rather then fight most businesses settle regardless of whether they are guilty or not. Walmart has gone away from that approach and it has started to pay dividens for them.
There have also been legitimate and illegitimate suits from employees of the company. Walmart has paid out back wages and been fined for labor law violations. They have not gotten entirely away with it. That said they are not the only company guilty of this. Companies of all shapes and sizes are guilty of various labor law law violations and statistically over 90% of all businesses have violated labor laws at some point, some knowingly and some unknowingly. Due to the class of people walmart targets it is no wonder they have such a high percentage of law suits (1 every 2 hours) filed against them.
Now the real question for all the haters is: Do you really care or are you jealous of the success the company has had operating the way it does? I am pretty sure that most here would love to be able to have some control over supplier prices. Why wouldn't they? That would give them a heck of an advantage over their competition. I'll go it a step farther and say those of you large enough to get significant discounts do so, and then use those discounts to take work from your competitors. You negotiate the discount amount you get with your suppliers based on volume (if you say you're not you're either lieing or lack good business skills). Things starting to sound a little familiar now? I would venture to say some here have been guilty or are currently guilty of labor law violations. The most common one to the construction industry being mis-classification of employees (this includes the 1099 thing also).
As far as the comments related to capitalism; the majority here are in business to make money. That makes the majority of people here capitalists whether they like the term or not. Don't throw rocks when living in glass houses.
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What does any of that have to do with the fact that many vendors have moved to an inferior product line in order to meet walmarts price point?
Feel free to defend or not defend walmarts methods, actions and/or ethics. No amount of justification changes the fact that they sell cheap garbage at low prices to the masses.
What does any of that have to do with the fact that many vendors have moved to an inferior product line in order to meet walmarts price point?
Feel free to defend or not defend walmarts methods, actions and/or ethics. No amount of justification changes the fact that they sell cheap garbage at low prices to the masses.
I have never found that but i don't shop in their that much. They do however have TV's and electronics that are wal-mart only models. They are exactly the same as the models in other outlets but they change the model numbers so that you cant price match. But CC and BB was also known to do the exact same thing. I really don't think any company would risk putting out an inferior product to wal-mart just to be able to sell to them. I'm sure that they do sell some cheap crap though. Also i thought that almost everything that they sell has to go through some kind of QC before they are allowed to sell it. Again just because of lawsuits.
As I said I am not defending walmart. That said a lot of the information available by searching Google comes from special interest groups. I would not consider that information 100% reliable. They use the 3 S's business model (this is taught in business classes on the college level for those who don't know) and implement it much more efficiently then most. Are some of their tactics questionable and unethical? Absolutely.
The companies that get in bed with them are well aware of what they are getting into. They are not able able to bully all the companies who's products they carry. The general consensus among companies that opt to conduct business with walmart is either they do well or walmart takes advantage of them. It is split pretty evenly down the middle. Walmart views its relationship with its suppliers as a partnership and does provide assistance to those companies to help them lower production costs. Mike this is where you are correct on many of your statements as one of those "steps" may include outsourcing or moving production plants overseas. They do account for a significant amount of sales (up to 20%) for many companies and that does deter some companies from walking away from what they consider to be an unfair shake.
Walmart does use this knowledge to "renegotiate" and has been known to set the price the will pay for products suppliers. They are credited with flipping the supply chain backwards due to their approach. Again those who get in bed with them are aware of all this and make the decision that it is better for their company to do this. Walmart has not been successful in it's approach with all companies that it deals with as some are to large and have enough other outlets to distribute their products through that walmart is just another tool, not the tool.
As to the high amount of law suits; while this statement is true it is a blanket statement. Walmart does have a high percentage of lawsuits. A very high percentage of those suits can be attributed to "frivolous" suits by customers such as the furby incident, people slipping in the store, injuries while doing things such as exercise equipment in the store. There have also been suits based on incidents in walmart parking lots that go from security related to carts bumping into cars, carts bumping into people, people bumping into people, weather related accidents and so on. These can probably be attributed to the target audience of walmart. This has led to walmart taking an unusual strategy of fighting almost everything in court. This stratigy has helped to reduce the number of suits over the years. Remember the usual business tactic with regards to lawsuits is not one of right or wrong but one of economics. If costs less to settle rather then fight most businesses settle regardless of whether they are guilty or not. Walmart has gone away from that approach and it has started to pay dividens for them.
There have also been legitimate and illegitimate suits from employees of the company. Walmart has paid out back wages and been fined for labor law violations. They have not gotten entirely away with it. That said they are not the only company guilty of this. Companies of all shapes and sizes are guilty of various labor law law violations and statistically over 90% of all businesses have violated labor laws at some point, some knowingly and some unknowingly. Due to the class of people walmart targets it is no wonder they have such a high percentage of law suits (1 every 2 hours) filed against them.
Now the real question for all the haters is: Do you really care or are you jealous of the success the company has had operating the way it does? I am pretty sure that most here would love to be able to have some control over supplier prices. Why wouldn't they? That would give them a heck of an advantage over their competition. I'll go it a step farther and say those of you large enough to get significant discounts do so, and then use those discounts to take work from your competitors. You negotiate the discount amount you get with your suppliers based on volume (if you say you're not you're either lieing or lack good business skills). Things starting to sound a little familiar now? I would venture to say some here have been guilty or are currently guilty of labor law violations. The most common one to the construction industry being mis-classification of employees (this includes the 1099 thing also).
As far as the comments related to capitalism; the majority here are in business to make money. That makes the majority of people here capitalists whether they like the term or not. Don't throw rocks when living in glass houses.
You've changed my mind. Walmart is the best corporate citizen on the planet.
It's all jealousy and internet propaganda. Maybe Mythbusters will do an episode and debunk all the Walmart myths.
Run, don't walk to the bottom, run to it!!!!! That's the secret for service related business, -- be like Walmart.
What does any of that have to do with the fact that many vendors have moved to an inferior product line in order to meet walmarts price point?
Feel free to defend or not defend walmarts methods, actions and/or ethics. No amount of justification changes the fact that they sell cheap garbage at low prices to the masses.
They find ways to make the production process more economic this can be done a number of ways. Many of which can leave a bitter taste in the mouths of of others. There are "inferior" products produced by many vendors and sold at many outlets. This is not solely a wlamart phenomenon.
Think about this reasonably; if every product Walmart sold was of inferior quality then how would they stay in business? They wouldn't, people would eventually get tired of buying the same product over and over and realize it is more cost effective to spend more on the product one time then to purchase it twenty times at Walmart.
Coincidentally no manufacturer inspects 100% of goods produced for quality standards. The cost to do so would be astronomical. All manufactures do quality control on a percentage basis. Look at your own policies and you will find you probably do not inspect 100% of your work for quality either. Why? It is not cost effective for you to do so.
I think a lot of people are taking the walmart thing personally. It's not personal it's just business. Ultimately it is the consumers who decide if Walmarts business practices will be allowed to continue. Currently consumers support their approach as it benifits them. Until that changes Walmart will continue to be a force to be reckoned with.
You've changed my mind. Walmart is the best corporate citizen on the planet.
It's all jealousy and internet propaganda. Maybe Mythbusters will do an episode and debunk all the Walmart myths.
Run, don't walk to the bottom, run to it!!!!! That's the secret for service related business, -- be like Walmart.
Mike,
I'm not trying to change your mind and I don't believe Walmart is the best corporate citizen on the planet. Their not even close. I'm am just playing devils advocate and trying to point out there are different sides to every story. Their business approach like it or not has been extremely successful and is utilized at a lesser level by many businesses with regards to suppliers and volume purchases. As I said it is the consumers who will ultimately decide whether or not they will continue to operate the way they do.
It would takes hours and days of therapy and intervention to show you the error of your ways and your 'devil's advocacy', your praise of "flipping the supply chain back wards' and all the rest.
If you go back to your first replies defending Walmart's practices or defending them or acting in shock and denial, then you shortly turn around and give examples of praise for those tactics and place the blame on the victims.
You've drank the cool aid my friend. Good luck as a GC practicing walmart's business philosophies. Those tactics will win you some short term profits but guarantee you long term failure in a service business.
So now let the acquisitions fly. Because I don't bow down to you and your view point and side with agenda driven organizations I automatically run my company like Walmart. That is about as common as it gets. I did not credit Walmart with flipping the supply chain I said they where credited with doing so. I quoted actual circumstances, figures, policies, to shed a little more light on it all and now I alone am the evil PR champion of Walmart. Get real. I simply stated there strategies and how they have been effective for them. The only thing I can be accused of defending is whether or not their products are of inferior quality and I think I made my point on that particular subject.
The only thing I can be accused of defending is whether or not their products are of inferior quality
I can read your replies from the top of the thread to the bottom. You should do it it too. You defend Walmart on about a dozen points not just their products are inferior quality. WTF man does your browser only show you your last post? You seem to have screen amnesia.
And as you said "you side with agenda driven organizations". We can translate that to I side with Walmart right? We are talking about Walmart here right? The only 'agenda driven' organization we are talking about is Walmart so far right?
Read your replies from top to bottom. Good for you for siding with Walmart. Somebody has to I guess.
And if you run your business like the 'agenda driven' organizations you side with, (defend, look up to, identify with...etc...), then good luck.
You either don't comprehend well, need to get glasses, or get your glasses adjusted, I never said I side with agenda driven organizations. I said the opposite with the reference being that a lot of the information being reported and used here as the basis for argument is from anti-Walmart agenda web sites. I have said repeatedly I am not defending Walmarts practices and furthermore any information that I used did not come from either pro-Walmart or anti-Walmart organizations.
Again to the innuendos huh? I guess if you have no logical stance on the subject it's easier to resort to name calling and accusations. I do not agree with all of Walmarts business practices and have said or implied as much. I do not agree that all of their products are infierior either. Before you throw any more accusations at me take a long look at your company and make sure all your T's are crossed and all your i's are dotted. I would reckon a guess that you practice some of the same negotiating practices on a smaller scale that Walmart and many other businesses do. You know that whole if I purchase xxx amount from y supply house what kind of discount does my company qualify for. If you don't practice this technique you are missing out on potential profits and not serving your customer or your business as well as you could be. Like it or not thats the cold hard truth.
If you don't practice this technique you are missing out on potential profits and not serving your customer or your business as well as you could be. Like it or not thats the cold hard truth.
Spoken like a GC who looks up to Walmart.
I always love when the slip up comes in. "serving your customers as well as you could be"
That right there exposes yourself.
Let me translate that for you: it means - "providing lowers costs for customers" by screwing others.
I can guarantee you that 9 out of 10 contractors no matter how poor of business men they are, run a better quality business when it comes to customer service, quality of product, timely delivery, treatment and respect for employees, treatment of customers and treatment of vendors then Walmart does.
40,000! 
And then the rest of the Crapmart story begins how they get infrastructure for free with the promise of jobs, then when the city is about to get their cut from Crapmart they move 1 mile outside city limits. 
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