is cad software worth for me? - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

mike stanislaw · 12-13-2008, 10:09 AM

I'm no genus when it comes to cad drawing but with time i could learn how. i draw my own plans the old way top view side elevations and section details.
lately I've seen some cad perspectives of 3 dimension with color. I'm impressed with some but others still are like cartoons. does anyone out there know the best cad that is affordable for a small company??
thanks mike

Vince_B · 12-13-2008, 10:17 AM

Have you tried Google Sketchup? It's free and there on online free video tutorials.

ScipioAfricanus · 12-13-2008, 11:03 AM

In my experience you can't do better than Chief Architect for the money. If all you are doing is decking you may want to look at the Home designer Pro series of programs Chief has.

Next might be TurboCad, they have architectural packs for their Pro series like for windows, doors and such.

Then look at SolidBuilder, it is for residential and light commercial like Chief but not as easy to get 3D pics as Chief is.

Andy.

BTW Sketchup is terrific and works great with Chief Architect but it is not really a "cad" program.

**framerman** · 12-13-2008, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScipioAfricanus

BTW Sketchup is terrific and works great with Chief Architect but it is not really a "cad" program.

I think you will be getting some responses to the contrary on this statement. While it is not like AutoCAD, it certainly is good enough for design work, the "D" in CAD.

mike stanislaw · 12-13-2008, 01:00 PM

thanks everyone and i will check out all those sites. The main reason i want the cad is the 3 -d in color drawings for my up coming sales. they really give me an advantage over my competition, that doesn't have 3-d color prospectives or the quality of the one they have is inferior. my question again do you think its worth it. I'm not looking for low grade stuff here, keep in mind I'm not a big deck company either. we design price and complete about 25 projects a year.

mike

**framerman** · 12-13-2008, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike stanislaw

thanks everyone and i will check out all those sites. The main reason i want the cad is the 3 -d in color drawings for my up coming sales. they really give me an advantage over my competition, that doesn't have 3-d color prospectives or the quality of the one they have is inferior. my question again do you think its worth it. I'm not looking for low grade stuff here, keep in mind I'm not a big deck company either. we design price and complete about 25 projects a year.

mike

you are better off subbing it out IMO. CAD and 3d are 2 completely different beasts. CAD is mainly for drawings, 3d is mainly from modeling programs (and that does include many CAD programs)

The nice 3d usually does NOT come from 3d CAD systems. You can get decent looking stuff, but maybe not to fit your bill.

There are 3d graphic websites out there that you can hire guys usually from other countries (China, India, Spain, etc.) that have great reputations and are specialized in this market.

Check this out and you will see what I mean. They are usually a decent price. To even be close to these guys, you'd need a decent computer, decent 3d software, decent rendering engine, and lots of time to perfect the art.

mics_54 · 12-13-2008, 05:16 PM

Ultimately for the goals you describe you will need to become proficient at several levels and with multiple platforms. Certainly Sketchup, Cheif, turbocad, etc are capable or producing the results you desire when coupled with some rendering engines and addons and some talent and work on your part. It won't happen in a month. It will take time, effort and money. There is no program that does it all. Higher end programs will not be easier to learn and will cost alot of money. Most programs have opportunities to try before you buy. My one suggestion is whatever you decide to purchase..choose one with alot of support in the way of user forums. The fastest support is always from other users.
I use turbocad and sketchup and as a general contractor I cant imagine ever needing any programs with more capability...I certainly don't utilize them to their potential.

ScipioAfricanus · 12-13-2008, 11:39 PM

I have to respectfully disagree with some of what mics 54 said. TurboCAD has a pretty good rendering engine in the Acis, Sketchup will need an add-on rendering engine but Chief is probably the one that has it all.

Chief uses the Pov-Ray raytracer and a pretty good engine for the lower quality (than raytracing) renderings. In Chief you can save the model as a DWG. or 3DS file and raytrace in other programs. They have a great talk forum in ChiefTalk (check it out) with lots of users willing to help for free and they respond really quickly.

Some of the Chiefers are raytracing in Kerkythea and making really great stuff. For the 3D eye candy Chief is the way to go if you want to make it quick with the lowest learning curve, interior and exterior shots, landscaping, cabinet layout, any kind of residential or light comercial construction.

All this and you can do excellent construction documents with Chief.

I went from pounding nails, dealing with subs and all the other field related construction head-aches to design & drafting because I found Chief Architect. I will place some examples of things I did with it in another post shortly.

BTW I am not afiliated with Chief in any way I just love the program. It is very power, not perfect, but it is the best for the money. Revit (which I use also) is about $5-6K now, Chief is about $2.5K and there customer service is the best.

Andy.

mics_54 · 12-14-2008, 12:30 PM

why use revit if chief does it all?

Mike forget what I said...I have no idea what I am talking about..CA does everything..you should buy two copies and then it will do it twice as fast.

ScipioAfricanus · 12-14-2008, 02:36 PM

Hey mics, I never said or implied that you did not know what you are talking about. I also said that I felt that Chief was the best for the money but not perfect. I said that I respectfully disagree with some of what you said, if you want to be an a$$hole about it then I can play too.

I use Revit for the heavy commercial and even for some residential stuff that is particularly tricky or if the Architect of record needs it done in Revit. I just find Chief to be the easiest to make models, change defaults and make con. docs, in.

Andy.

Burby · 12-14-2008, 02:53 PM

I like Chief Arc and have had it for some years, but is so user friendly and customer support is great. Just when they designed it, they were smart. Get one hooked on the ease of it then come the upgrades, $90 here, $150 there, $125 here, ect ect ect.. But is one of them things, stop when you want to or have enough for your needs.
The nice thing I like was when customers had a hard time to visualize an addition, furnishings, or maybe add 6 inches or a foot to room, so easy to do. Furnishings as well, place them in the room and move them were ever.
It is so interesting and user friendly sometimes the customer gets wrapped up in all the things can easily do that they have spent a thousand or more just enjoying the fun on fantasy room(s) that now they have to build to justify the money they just spent..

As with anything, there has to be a need for it and one has to have the time to properly learn all the program offers.

mike stanislaw · 12-14-2008, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burby

I like Chief Arc and have had it for some years, but is so user friendly and customer support is great. Just when they designed it, they were smart. Get one hooked on the ease of it then come the upgrades, $90 here, $150 there, $125 here, ect ect ect.. But is one of them things, stop when you want to or have enough for your needs.
The nice thing I like was when customers had a hard time to visualize an addition, furnishings, or maybe add 6 inches or a foot to room, so easy to do. Furnishings as well, place them in the room and move them were ever.
It is so interesting and user friendly sometimes the customer gets wrapped up in all the things can easily do that they have spent a thousand or more just enjoying the fun on fantasy room(s) that now they have to build to justify the money they just spent..

As with anything, there has to be a need for it and one has to have the time to properly learn all the program offers.

think that would work for deck and 3-d color and how much does it add to my plans i draw?/

AutumnWood Inc. · 12-14-2008, 06:34 PM

If you have not already, take a look at Deck Tools. We have it and really like it. It is geared to the deck builder and it has some nice rendering capabilities, and alot more. There was a recent thread about Deck Tools in the decking forum or try searching for it.

Here is rendering

mics_54 · 12-14-2008, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Hey mics, I never said or implied that you did not know what you are talking about. I also said that I felt that Chief was the best for the money but not perfect. I said that I respectfully disagree with some of what you said, if you want to be an a$$hole about it then I can play too.

I use Revit for the heavy commercial and even for some residential stuff that is particularly tricky or if the Architect of record needs it done in Revit. I just find Chief to be the easiest to make models, change defaults and make con. docs, in.

I didn't think I was being an a$$hole but whatever... you said you wanted to disagree with what I said but then you didnt say what it was you disagreed with.... you said CA has it all but then said it doesnt, you said it's the best buy for the money but I didn't say it wasn't. All I said was that he wouldnt find one program that does everything .. to which you agreed. Basically I find CA rather limited for general cad functions and as a deck builder unless he sticks to standard details and doesnt do any custom hangars or hardware development or some other engineering type drawings out side the scope of CA capabilities he will be ok...but it semed like he might need a lower priced general cad 2D/3D program that imported and exported many file formats and doesnt need a 3rd party rendering engine to get photo realistic images. If CA "does it all" then I guess I'm wrong. If that isnt what you "disagreed" with then what was it exactly? Actually I'm pretty impressed with CA if all one wants to do is architectural documents.

ScipioAfricanus · 12-14-2008, 10:06 PM

Mike forget what I said...I have no idea what I am talking about..CA does everything..you should buy two copies and then it will do it twice as fast.

I never said you had no idea what you are talking about or implied it, I never said "Chief does everything", but it does a lot.

What I understood from Mike's post was that he wanted 3D capability, Chief does this in spades as well as REALLY Good cad work if you know how to use it. As for what I disagreed with you on was that you said

Quote:

Sketchup, Cheif, turbocad, etc are capable or producing the results you desire when coupled with some rendering engines and addons

I thought it was obvious in my post that Chief has its own rendering and raytrace engines, I did say that Chief "probably has it all" meaning for his needs as he stated. ( I still think so).

Anyway enough of this ***t I have to get back to work.

Andy.

mics_54 · 12-15-2008, 11:45 AM

Quote:

As for what I disagreed with you on was that you said

Quote:
Sketchup, Cheif, turbocad, etc are capable or producing the results you desire when coupled with some rendering engines and addons

I wonder if this type of nonsense is typical of the forum support one can expect from the Chief Architect community. Again you claim to disagree with me by contradicting your own claims. I think its becomeing clear (er) whom exactly doesn't know what they are talking about.
Anyway, in the spirit of goodwill I am willing to retract my statement. I can see now that it was inaccurate to suggest that Sketchup, Chief Architect and Turbocad, when coupled with some rendering engines and addons, are capable of producing the renderings Mike desired.

Respectfully,
Mics_54

javatom · 12-15-2008, 12:09 PM

I'm a design build company. I also do a lot of plans for other builders. Some of my clients build a lot of decks. I use chief architect. Do not waste your money on the cheap version. It can create 3-D but it can not do a layout. You need the layout to create construction documents (plans) for getting permits. The pro version has a big learning curve. I have done jobs for builders who own it and could not figure out how to operate it proficiently enough to get the job done. You will end up being able to easily show your clients a pretty picture of something you have no way to produce plans for. Sub it out. One last thing. For gods sake don't give this service away to your POTENTIAL clients. The builders I work with charge the client for the design. They act as my sales force. They love it because it does not cost them any out of pocket and they get to see if the client is serious or not.

mike stanislaw · 12-15-2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScipioAfricanus

Hey mics, I never said or implied that you did not know what you are talking about. I also said that I felt that Chief was the best for the money but not perfect. I said that I respectfully disagree with some of what you said, if you want to be an a$$hole about it then I can play too.

I use Revit for the heavy commercial and even for some residential stuff that is particularly tricky or if the Architect of record needs it done in Revit. I just find Chief to be the easiest to make models, change defaults and make con. docs, in.

Andy.

"SHOW ME THE MONEY" maybe i can see a sample.

ScipioAfricanus · 12-15-2008, 08:26 PM

Here are a couple I did, these have gone through Planning and Permit review for the city of Garden Grove CA.

And believe people have done can. docs. much better looking than this. My style is very utilitarian, I just put in what is needed and not a lot else.

It seems I can only upload three. I have lots more for other cities in Orange County.

I deal with engineers that I need to place their DWG files into Chief and this works great too.

mics 54 I have no more to say.

Andy.

mics_54 · 12-16-2008, 12:32 AM

Quote:

mics 54 I have no more to say.

Thank you!