Weird Bathroom estimate - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

Wild Blue · 11-09-2005, 08:43 PM

Pro Wall Guy, heres a fun one LOL

ok heres the details

These people have this bathroom its like 10 x 15 bigger than my bedroom LOL, and the ceilings are bout 12-15 feet high - anyway really tall.

They have asked me to paint over this wallpaper (which is BEAUTIFUL and a great job so no issues there)

There is 1 door , 2 windows, a garden tub (tiled around) shower stall - has paper on both sides, this 2 sink vanity has this 2 foot bumpout over so I need to paint over and above that up to ceiling.

Repair a hinge on door cause it doesnt line up right, all baseboards and trim, and also sponge paint 2 colors on 5 cabinets below the sinks (doors, trim and end)

so like 1-2 coats, primer gripper over paper, and 2 coats of paint, on walls.

offhand i dont have LF of trim, but not worried, i figure 3 days in there.

where would you come in with something like this? i know its vague but i cant describe any better at this point....

why cant i just get plain old rooms to paint? but i DO LOVE A CHALLENGE!

I was thinking around 500.00...

George Z · 11-09-2005, 09:01 PM

$1000.00 to 1,200.00 would be more like it, if your three days is our three days. ProWall will tell you the same or more.
If you have to paint over wallpaper, oil primer is best, as the Gripper may
soften the glue, being water based.

Wild Blue · 11-09-2005, 09:26 PM

Wow Toronto what a great tip as far as the oil based primer!

I can paint latex over oil but NOT oil over latex correct?

Bret · 11-09-2005, 09:37 PM

A price is hard to determine for someone else. Since you have figured it will take you three days labor, just add what you want to make in those three days and add the material cost. Personally I would'nt do it for less than 600 + material cost.

PipeGuy · 11-09-2005, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild Blue

...i figure 3 days in there.
I was thinking around 500.00...

I think my calculator is broken! $500 for 3 days work? You're in business for yourself, right? How can you cover operating expenses, much less earn a profit, for $167 per day? I must be missing something.

George Z · 11-09-2005, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild Blue

Wow Toronto what a great tip as far as the oil based primer!

I can paint latex over oil but NOT oil over latex correct?

You can paint anything over an oil primer

**ProWallGuy** · 11-09-2005, 09:54 PM

The rule of thumb is oil will adhere to latex, and latex will not adhere to oil. There are exceptions, but generally you don't put latex over oil unless the oil is a primer.

I can't afford to start my truck for $167 per day.

That bath you describe is an easy $1000 plus.

Don't ever go over paper unless its a very last resort. Don't create a nightmare for the next guy. Always remove paper if it can be removed. If the customer won't let me, I'll walk. You can't be sure how well the paper holds up after you apply your finish. Shame to see the paper fail, taking your coating with it. and it does happen. Primer/paint has more tensile pull when drying than you think. Same with wallcovering.

There has been talk about creating a sticky post on how to price out work, maybe its time.

Wild Blue · 11-09-2005, 10:13 PM

What do you use pro wall to talk off wallpaper? ive used vinegar and water and heat guns......what solvent do you use?

**ProWallGuy** · 11-09-2005, 10:19 PM

We start with plain water with a shot of dish detergent.
Then we move up to Safe & Simple 603.
The key is to soak it, soak it some more, and then soak it again until the w/c rejects the liquid. Cool water works better than hot, it won't evaporate near as fast.
Florr protection is the most important thing in removal. Once you get the floor completely protected, you can soak it until it will come off.
If you choose to score the surface with a paper tiger, be gentle. Its real easy to tear up the wall underneath.

AAPaint · 11-09-2005, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProWallGuy

The rule of thumb is oil will adhere to latex, and latex will not adhere to oil. There are exceptions, but generally you don't put latex over oil unless the oil is a primer.

I can't afford to start my truck for $167 per day.

That bath you describe is an easy $1000 plus.

Don't ever go over paper unless its a very last resort. Don't create a nightmare for the next guy. Always remove paper if it can be removed. If the customer won't let me, I'll walk. You can't be sure how well the paper holds up after you apply your finish. Shame to see the paper fail, taking your coating with it. and it does happen. Primer/paint has more tensile pull when drying than you think. Same with wallcovering.

There has been talk about creating a sticky post on how to price out work, maybe its time.

I think you flip-flopped it. You can put latex over oil, but not the other way around. Oil primer and acrylic latex topcoats are a dang good way to a number of different things.

For the paper. You have as good as a 50/50 chance painting over it. If PWG hung the paper, it can handle a coat of paint, hehe. I wouldn't put any guarantees on it, and if you're going to do it make sure your contract has a clause covering you and your good name.

I think once you make the customer understand the additional costs they will incur if it all comes crashing down, they can then see the value in removing it first!

**ProWallGuy** · 11-09-2005, 10:24 PM

When I say no latex over oil, I was referring to finish coats. Meaning, don't brush on some latex semi-gloss on trim that is previously coated with an oil enamel product. Adhesion will be non-existent unless the oil trim is prepped for it. Oil primer with acrylic topcoat is my usual style when I come across previously painted oil.

And no, I don't put an oil finish coat over a latex primer.

**ProWallGuy** · 11-09-2005, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAPaint

I wouldn't put any guarantees on it, and if you're going to do it make sure your contract has a clause covering you and your good name.

Speaking of clauses, use something similar to this if they won't let you remove it.

*In the event that the substrate or any prior coating fails beneath what the Contractor has installed and/or applied, the Contractor will not be held liable for the failure of the substrate or any coating.

Wild Blue · 11-09-2005, 10:38 PM

Good advice all! Thanks again and ProWall thats a great clause! Thanks!

Hey what do u charge for 2 things:

Wallpaper removal and sanding and painting baseboard trim? (you must think by now Im an idiot! ..but lately Ive expanded into more than just bare wall painting!) Thanxs

**ProWallGuy** · 11-09-2005, 10:53 PM

Pricing depends on the type of wallcovering, the substrate its installed on, the adhesive used, and if primed or not. I test drive a spot before I price it. Determine all the factors, and look at production for this type of paper/wall/paste combo. Then price by sq. ft. per manhour.

Same with the trim.

**slickshift** · 11-10-2005, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProWallGuy

Don't ever go over paper unless its a very last resort. Don't create a nightmare for the next guy. Always remove paper if it can be removed. If the customer won't let me, I'll walk. You can't be sure how well the paper holds up after you apply your finish. Shame to see the paper fail, taking your coating with it. and it does happen. Primer/paint has more tensile pull when drying than you think. Same with wallcovering.

Worth repeating:

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProWallGuy

Don't ever go over paper unless its a very last resort. Don't create a nightmare for the next guy. Always remove paper if it can be removed. If the customer won't let me, I'll walk. You can't be sure how well the paper holds up after you apply your finish. Shame to see the paper fail, taking your coating with it. and it does happen. Primer/paint has more tensile pull when drying than you think. Same with wallcovering.

I agree 100%, me too and yes yes yes

**slickshift** · 11-10-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild Blue

I was thinking around 500.00...

For what you described I'm figuring 1100, 1200
But labor (and cost of living) is high here
Even if you are in a low overhead area, I suspect that 500 is low

AAPaint · 11-10-2005, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProWallGuy

When I say no latex over oil, I was referring to finish coats. Meaning, don't brush on some latex semi-gloss on trim that is previously coated with an oil enamel product. Adhesion will be non-existent unless the oil trim is prepped for it. Oil primer with acrylic topcoat is my usual style when I come across previously painted oil.

And no, I don't put an oil finish coat over a latex primer.

I'm with ya!