JMGP

I saw an advertisement at the top of one of these pages about how to bid painting... after reading the site my curiosity got the best of me...

even though I don't have any issues with paint estimating I purchased the information... I'm like a sponge when it comes to information and I thought there may be something extra I may learn...

the information was excellent as far as explaining the process... so for those of you that are just starting out or those that need a little more explaining or direction for paint estimating I highly recommend this information....

the site is www.howtobidpaintjobs.com

lornmastro

sounds interesting...how many pages is the system...did you really think the tips he talks about were business altering??

JMGP

This information is mostly geared toward the "new guy" starting out that has no clue how to put together an estimate/contract/scope...

The tips I guess "could be" business altering but it is nothing drastic... as with anyone giving you tips and telling you they will be "business altering"... it is up to you and How you apply those tips...

THINKPAINTING

I purchased a very old and rare estimating book online a couple yrs ago. This book is great, it"s all about paint estimating and how to unit price work. One cent a sq ft was the going rate, I have to say the information in this book is priceless.

It explains and shows how in the old days the Painting trade was an art, you had to know many different things to be a journeyman painter and even more to be a estimator.

Paid $75.00 worth $$$$$$$ to me.

farrellpainting

I'll admit that when I first started I lowballed my first few estimates out of fear that I would'nt get the job because I'm young and brand new on the market, however, I knew in the back of my head that I was screwing myself because I know my production rates from being in the feild.Which brings me to the question (ive asked before) how and why do you count on some program to do your estimates?I would think that one going into business should already know how to do this?

These things are'nt cheap either from what I've noticed, can someone explain the REAL VALUE of these things, other than the fact that they are for idiots, in my ignorant opinion!

MattCoops

figure your overhead, payroll, and what you want as profit
no book necessary, just a pencil, pad, and arithmatic

if you want to pick up a book, try a book on developing listening skills
or a book on effective human relations

sales books are for real estate agents and car salesmen

If you are selling a paint job you are fighting for attention.
Be the contractor that becomes a friend to the customer.
You'll be surprised at how many low-ballers you beat out that way.
Killz them with Kindness
Be knowledgeable - Win them with Wisdom

__________________
Matt; tile contractor in Charlotte, NC
704-605-0907
Tweeting @MattCupan | read my articles

JMGP

I'm glad that you stated that this was your "ignorant opinion"... because its obvious you do not know what you are talking about...

The site that I posted is NOT a "program" it is information that could be valuable for the painters just starting out and/or some that are already in business... it is a helpful guide/tool ...

I will bet that not one painter that is in business on this board started out knowing everything or had a "perfect" system in place... you even stated yourself that you purposely "low balled" in the beginning just to get work... why do you think that is??... you probably didn't have a "system" in place or the know how...

Having a "system" is the MOST IMPORTANT part of your business...I will guarantee that some of the most respected paint contractors on this board like Brian & George Z have a tight system in place BUT... I bet they still seek out information and/or tools to better there system, technique, format etc etc... I'm going on my 5th year in business and I change parts of my system every year... it gets better and stronger... and that = more sales + more money... I seek out information no matter where it comes from....

The estimate software out there is just a tool... they are not estimating programs... they are just data bases for information...you have to configure them to work for your company (put in your own data)... they are only used for printing high quality formated estimates and keeping data records...

Those of us that use them (myself included) will never go back to hand written or other slow or inconsistent ways of putting together an estimate...

The "REAL VALUE" of these programs and information that is out there is how YOU use it...

In my opinion the ones that want to be in business but do not want to take the time to develop better skills, gather information, expand their know how... may be the idiot... because they are just asking for failure or to stay at one level... maybe thats why you only do exterior painting??

So before you start calling other "professional" painters "idiots" for using information or tools to better there business... you should educate yourself first... its elementary... education is key to success...

I hope I was able to clarify your "ignorant opinion"...

boman47k

Humble Abode

That turned me off right away... That statement is absurd.

__________________
Just because some of us can read and write and do a little math, that doesn't mean we deserve to conquer the Universe. Kurt Vonnegut, (1922 - 2007) from the Novel 'Hocus Pocus'
The NAPP
Milwaukee Painting Contractor

JMGP

Yes... there are a few things in there that should be worded differently... I think what got my curiousity was that they were strong claims and I "had to" buy the information just to see what it was all about... and like I said... the information is mostly geared for the new guy... and/or someone that needs a proper format/guide for estimating...

I posted the site because there are A LOT of questions reguarding "how to" estimate... bla bla bla... this information is a great guide for that...

I was very impressed at how he broke it down and simplified it for people to easily understand thats why I recommended it...

THINKPAINTING

I could not agree more...Go to a estimating semminar by Len Fife or Bob Cosamaro and most painters will see how little they know about overhead or estimating. Great post.....

electro

If you are not using some type of estimating system, you are missing one of the most important tools in your box. For a few reasons.
1. Without an estimate system, you have the potential for human error. Missing items, underestimating items. Try this. Think of a meal you can cook. Go to the supermarket without a list, and buy all the items you need to prepare that meal. Good chance as you start to cook, you will relize you forgot something as well as you bought some things you didn't need. Now you must go back to the supermarket, (time lost), or the quality of your meal will suffer. Relate that to your job. How much does the lack of an estimating system cost your company a year in lot production and material errors.
2. Ever think about selling your business? The thing a purchaser buys is the systems a business has to make money. They want to be able to walk in the door, and be able to operate and grow. How can they if everything is in your head.
So, your system does not have to be a computer based program, (although you'd be wise to) but it must be some written and consistent system to measure and document items painted and delivery methods.

Brian
Drucks Inc.

Brian

I completely agree. I use a data base that I wrote myself (I couldn't find anything that does exactly what I want). But it is only a tool. It allows me to calculate prices quickly and accurately. It allows me to write detailed proposals quickly and easily. It allows me to retrieve information quickly. But it is still only a tool.

Just because I use software doesn't mean I leave my brain at the door when I sit down to use it. Quite the contrary, I am constantly tweaking production rates, wording, etc. It is an ongoing process.

Having a system is the most important point. If you want consistent results, you must take consistent actions. Systems help you take consistent actions.

You wouldn't attempt to paint interior walls with a 2" brush-- you'd select a tool more appropriate to the task. Why should it be any different in regard to other aspects of the business? Select the best tools to accomplish the task.

Brian Phillips

__________________
Houston Painters
Houston Radiant Barriers