cowtown

I'm working on a basement finish and the homeowner wants to stain doors and windows. I haven't done much staining so I was wondering a couple of things. It's cherry wood and I'm matching what's upstairs which is something like "natural cherry stain" (it's not too dark) and it looks like a satin type gloss finish.

Coats??? Do you usually stain more than one coat? Or is it typical to stain one coat and then varnish or polyurethane one coat? Should I always expect to put some sort of varnish on after staining?

Application??? Is it best to brush on and then wipe off excess with a rag? (There is about 9 doors.) Would anyone roll on stain, if so what type of cover?

Teetorbilt

Upstairs, downstairs doesn't make much difference as nobody will ever see them side-by-side. Close will be good.

Take some scraps from downstairs and a couple of cans of stain that's pretty close, go upstairs and mix and match. I prefer to rub in the stain with a wad of cheesecloth (wear gloves). You will need to varnish over.

__________________
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simmons

Just finished custom waterfront with a similiar situation-all the doors and windows are pine and we had to match to the cabinets(maple and alder)
first thing I would do-double check that the species of all wood is the same
second-TRY to acquire the formula the upstairs were finished with. You didn't mention what type of stain you have there (water, oil ,-lacquer it will make a difference on application techniques)
third-cherry has a tendency to blotch.(many shops have a multi-step staining process to minimize blotching)this can be very noticeable on large pieces such as doors. You might consider a wood conditioner prior to staining if it is an oil based stain, a wash coat for a lacquer based(which will take a little research with your stain type)
fourth-If these doors and windows have alot of detail , consider using an HVLP sprayer. Its almost impossible to get stain into so many areas evenly.
Lastly-the clear coat. Lacquer is one of the fastest easiest ways-but-are there warranty issues to deal with? The mfg. of the windows we just finished required three coats of exterior grade clear. Found that out just after the stain was applied! Might consider a water based (premium quality!!!)exterior spar urethane since the drying time is significantly faster than oil based and theres no need for a separate sealer as in a lacquer system. And no way would I consider anything but spraying!!!
my two cents.

Woz the Painter

First match up the stain, remember that the finish [varnish] will deepen the color. I would then sand all the doors to be stained going with the grain, with 220 paper, then dust and tack. How mant coats? That you will have to determine, by how even the stain is when dry, and how the color matches. I would apply with a brush and a lambswool stain pad, about $14.00 at Sherwin Williams, then wipe with clean rag, under even pressure, with the grain. How long you leave the stain on will determine depth of color, just don't leave on till it dries completly. Once you get your system down, do all remaining doors in the same manner. When stain is dry, use sanding sealer or varnish for 1st coat, which will raise the grain, then when dry, sand with grain, tack, then put on at least one more coat of varnish.

cowtown

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Thanks for the very specific suggestions.

Not having done a job like this I want to come up with a price per door. Is it comparable to painting a door or always more? I know I have to consider the speed that I work and all that but this sounds more labor intensive than painting a door. Is $150/door a familiar price...way low/high?

Related staining question. I plan to stain door jamb and trim first, this will be next to unfinished drywall. Do you mask unfinshed drywall with tape or not worry about it figuring that you will be priming the drywall anyways? Should I be concerned about getting stain onto unfinished drwall?

CarlW

Man, if you don't know what you are doing, the worst place to probably learn is on expensive cherry in somebody's home, but okay. As for the match, try to get the stain used upstairs and if you can't get that, take a sample and have the paint store match it for you. If you don't even stain, I can't imagine doing a custom match would go that well for you either. Don't plan on staining twice ever....I have been painting 20 years and have never stained anything twice. You hit your color on the first try and if the color is wrong, get the stain tweaked. Staining twice to achieve a darker color is a waste of labor time. Also, do not use a varnish as your first coat and do not use a poly as your first coat. They just don't sand that well and your finished look will not be smooth as glass the way we like it. You need to use a sanding sealer as your first coat IMO...sanding sealer makes your sanding block glide, like a lubricant for sanding. Sanding poly and varnish sucks. If you are trying to do one coat of finish and be done with it, that's just not going to work because the wood will be rough...plenty of hacker painters do that though.

Can you stain all the loose trim before they hang it? This is the way we do it when we can...keeps the stain off the wall, but if you do get stain on the wall, it is really no big deal. You just may need multiple coats of paint to cover the stain. As for pricing, I have found that stain/seal/varnish is actually faster than painted trim so the price would be lower, but not by much. It really depends on your system...once you get used to staining, you get pretty fast at it and with staining there is no caulking involved so you are eliminating a step entirely. I can stain a door in 8-12 minutes depending on the condition.

cowtown

[quote=CarlW]Man, if you don't know what you are doing, the worst place to probably learn is on expensive cherry in somebody's home, but okay.

I'll have to agree, that's why I'm asking all these questions. It's pushing my skills but I plan to do tests on scrap sheets and get approved by owner before actually applying any stain on trim. In the end I may call in a fellow painter with more experience.

Since it is in the downstairs the match is not super critical but I'm mostly concerned with the finish.

Thanks CarlW

Woz the Painter

cowtown not knowing what part of the country your in, how much money you want to make, your overhead, profit, etc. it's impossible to say what you should charge. staining doors IMHO is a lot more work [steps] than painting a door. As CarlW said if you haven't done this before, it might be a good idea to bring in someone more experienced and watch and learn from them. Let us know how things turn out.

Teetorbilt

I'm going with Woz on this one. Paint is a no-brainer compared to even semi matching an existing finish.

I usually go in with a 'witness stick' with 6 variations, narrow it down to 3 and fine tune from there. I don't like to brag, but I'm pretty good.

__________________
You can't solve you're problems with the same level of thinking that created the problems.

Albert Einstein