Dorman Painting

So today I get a phone call from a pleasant lady who has a 13000 square foot house that needs finished painting. They had a painter that bailed, according to her though, they liked his work but he won't come back. My speculation is that he was over his head and didn't have the job priced correctly and cut bait.

I'm meeting up with her tomorrow to get a good look at the house. She says it's 75-80 percent complete, HO's normally have no idea when it comes to this though, so it's an uneducated guess IMO.

Here's my question, would you shoot her a solid number, a ballpark number or work by the man hour. I told her on the phone that when coming into a job behind someone like this, I might have to work by the man hour. Of course charging someone 40 dollars a man hour tends to make them freak out, but at least my bases are covered by going that route. Any opinions?

plazaman

we never go by man hours simply the HO will start to question, well how long does it take to ....

You are going to give an estimate, she doesnt need a ballpark, she needs a solid number so she knows what it will take to finish her job.

__________________
www.perfectocorp.com

PlainPainter

If $40/man-hour makes someone freak out, then you don't want them as a customer. I'd say bail, definitely the only option would be to charge by the hour, and tell them your rate is $50/hr - and you need a week pay upfront. This way if you get it - then you have covered your bases - if they don't want to agree to your terms - trust me, you won't miss not having them as customers.

Thepaintman

By the job not the hour unless you like people to stand over you and look at their watch.

Make sure you cover yourself plus some. I would walk but that's me and it is determined on how hungry you are. Lots of luck!

Jerry

Thag

Bid it out like you would any other job. I had a lady up my arse until we completed the job cause it was hourly. After turning in labor hours she questioned me about the total.

Chris G

I think charging by the hour might be a good idea in this case. You don't really know what the previous painter did until you start getting into it, plus you will get a bead on this customer right away from her reaction. 13000 square feet that is partially done? How can you estimate that?

And ask lots of questions about the previous painter. Make it a casual conversation though. If she is comfortable with you she will let a few things spill out of her mouth that will give you an indication of what you are in for, be it good or bad.

I have gone to look at jobs where the previous guy bailed, and I can usually tell what is store for me fairly quickly. I had one lady criticize the previous guys work as we walked through her house. I wish I knew who the guy was because I have yet to see better woodwork in my life. I ran out there as soon as I found an excuse to leave.

dincao

I would say to go there first look @ what is needed to complete...Then you can probably get a good or bad feeling from ho as to what you can expect...Given that this is truley a 13,000 sq ft home then even @ 70% complete would mean that there is a substantial amount of work left..I would give them a firm price and get a deposit...

threaderman

I have customers on occasion that I will let choose hourly or flat-rate.It sounds odd but works for my business.Flexibility for the customer,and my O.H. and profit are covered either way.Personally, the more I flat-rate the better ,and better for the business.

__________________
Joe ---International Code Council Member

Your plumbing & gas specialist proudly serving Oklahoma City OK, Moore, Warr-acres, Norman, Midwest City, Edmond, Bethany, Forest Park

Dorman Painting

I heard through the grapevine that she fired the crew for smoking to many cigarettes in her house. So, I can't blame her for that if she laid the guidelines down from the get go but...lot's of guy's smoke indoors when it's cold outside.

I'll look around and get a handle on the job, and if I feel I can't for whatever reason get a good handle on it, I'll shoot her a man hour rate. I too love the man hour jobs because I've normally made most of my money on them.

troym

Be a pro, and give her a firm eastimate. That is how you learn.

kevjob

if anyone ever smokes anything in my clients house, adios!

__________________
Kevin
Highlands Ranch Co, bathroom remodeling
Aurora Co, Bathroom Remodeling
Kitchen Remodeling Denver

Tin Cup

Hmmmm. doesn't like smoking in the house.....I wonder if she minds anyone drinking ?

new customer, gotta be firm on price and expect a depost for at least materials (and drinking money).

seriously, you can't decide anything until you meet with her.

Keep us updated. wear whites without burn holes for that good first impression.

Tin Cup

Dorman Painting

Well, I just walked in the door from meeting with her. Very nice lady, this house is a knock your socks type of home. It belongs in Palm Beach or some other ritzy zip code.

My problem with the whole job is the approach the other painter took. Apparently he's convinced them that the walls are done...they do have finish coats on them and look solid. Here's the problem for me, NONE of the trim is prepped, primed or painted.

I explained to her that on a job like this, and most new construction for that matter, I always prime the walls first and then let the trim guy do his thing. Upon the trim guy finishing, I prep, spray primer/finish and then run two coats of finish on walls. This guy did just opposite of what I would've done given the situation.

I explain to her that I could still prep the trim and then spray it, but that would also cause me to run more finish coats on the walls. She seemed convinced that the walls were done and really wasn't high on the idea of getting any overspray on them. I then told her I could do it the old fashioned way...brush everything. I also bid the job by the man hour, even though I had a fairly solid number in my head. This trim situation dictated the bidding process, if I've got to brush primer and two finish coats on what adds up to be a huge forest of trim, I'm not getting burnt by shooting her a solid number that just doesn't hold up in the long run because of trim issues.

She's getting several more bids, I told her that I could definitely finish the job for her the way I bid it. There will probably be some hack that bids it at 25000 grand and walks out on her again...

BTW, I wore nice blue jeans, polo type button up shirt and somewhat casual dress shoes. I was going to go over the top and pimp up, but didn't do it. I'd come off as some high priced salesman that way.

dincao

Well if she is getting other bids that are not hr. rate did you give her a not to exceed bid so she can compare...If you have to paint all the trim are there coffered ceilings, wainscotting, built-ins, doors, windows etc....are you gonna do in oil or latex, if you have to do primer and 3 coats by brush on a 13,000 sq ft house you will be there for 2 months atleast w/ 4 man crew...Shes looking @ $50,000 atleast for millwork..

Dorman Painting

Your numbers were VERY close to where I am, I was actually thinking 50 grand the whole time but didn't pull the trigger and tell her that. If I get the job I'll probably go SW Pro Classic semi gloss latex on trim. The library is good sized and it's all stained with two coats of varnish, oh and the ceiling in the library is tongue and groove that gets stained too.

Actually, if I shoot her between 50-60 grand, I've worked it out by the man hour and they come out close in the long run. I know a lot of guys on here would've just told her 75 grand and left it at that, but the economy here in Indiana won't hold up to that type of price.