Primer Vs.

Smoothy

I have a man on my crew who insists he can do a better job by not priming new drywall, instead going for one coat of thick undiluted high quality paint-yeilding faster more profitable results. Is he right? I have ALWAYS primed new drywall. His method seems use up a lot more paint.

ProWallGuy

MHO is:

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Digital Murals Installation

Smoothy

You say he is wrong. Specifically, WHY is he wrong? Why should you always prime?

ProWallGuy

Because of the fact that primers prime the wall for the finish coat. They contain binders that adhere to the drywall. Paint includes binders too, but not in the capacity that primers do. Tell him to quit trying to do shortcuts, and paint it the right way.
Read this article from the Paint Quality Institute.

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Joewho

It's common practice to lay paint on drywall. And it doesn't have to be super high quality. Check out S/W HB, a high build paint that will do the trick.

I agree that it should be primed, however, that doesn't mean the next guy has to do it.

The answer to your question is, yes. It can be done, if that's the type of work and reputation you want.

thom

There are some paints that are designed to go right on unprimed drywall. They still require two coats minimum. The benefit is you're not switching out paints when spraying, spending time cleaning your sprayer.

In a two story house, there is a difference in time.
With Primer:
carry sprayer upstairs, prime upstairs
carry sprayer downstairs, prime downstairs
clean out sprayer
paint downstairs flat
carry sprayer upstairs, paint upstairs flat
clean out sprayer
paint upstairs semi-g
carry sprayer downstairs paint semi-g
Without Primer
carry sprayer upstairs, paint complete
second coat flat walls and ceilings
carry sprayer downstairs, paint complete
second coat flat walls and ceilings
carry sprayer upstairs, paint semi-g
carry sprayer downstairs, paint semi-g

It seems to save about an hour. Painting a house is a full days work to begin with, that hour, stretched into a second day, and cleaning the sprayer that extra time becomes a half day.

Woz the Painter

Why would you clean the pump between primer and finish coat?

After priming, just run the finish coat into the pump and clean out at the end of the day.

AAPaint

LoL!! My thoughts exactly.

I've heard every excuse in the world not to use primer. I don't buy a single one. Primer is what prepares the surface to accept paint. I just don't get it. Where do pros get the idea that it's cool to be skipping primer on RAW surfaces of any kind???

Why do they even make primer if you don't need it??????? Do most painters really believe it's just a racket to take more of your money? Think of how many things you would never paint without a proper primer. How is a house any different?

I'm not the brightest guy, so the logic of this one might just be escaping me.....

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-AAPaint

AA Quality Painting & Pressure Washing LLC
Jacksonville Painters
Jacksonville, FL.

thom

AA you ask why do they make primer if you don't need it. Why not ask, why do they make paint that doesen't require primer if primer is needed?

as for cleaning the pump between paints, I guess I should have said flushed the pump.

painterofeveryt

I have come to this conclusion,some people like to use primers,some dont,,,also one more time saving tip get a longer hose so you do not have to carry your pump up and down those stairs !!!!!

fferris

With a 100' line, I can usually do an interior from one location. As for primers, a rep at Kelly-Moore told me pva was unnecessary. If I'm doing high-end, I'll figure a coat of modified acrylic (1-2-3 BIN), which can be tinted to the finish color. I would sometimes use good-quality flat acrylic finish directly on drywall, but I wouldn't trust satin or semi-gloss.

Smoothy

One word of mouth reply I heard was the "secret" of skipping primmer is a comercial painter's money making secret and should not be spread on the web! Those who don't know the "secret" techniques of "commercial panters just don't know what really going on in the "real" world. Personnally, I do everything by the book, and I prime. I don't use secret techniques or money making tricks. I do an honest job at a fair price and people appreciate that-so I stay in business. I am very skeptical of "secret" money making methods, thank you.

metomeya

PRIME IT! PRIME IT UP! PRIMTE IT DOWN!

Primer is going to seal the surface also, and prevent flashing, etc. etc.

I hate it when I'm doing a new house, and its flat wall paint, and you can tell they didn't use primer under it, cause my paint is being soaked up. Or they used really thinned out primer, which doesn't really do anything.

ComicMan

Hmm, Wow, and I always thaught Primier Paint was always an extra Money Maker


Pretty Good Article..

I always used Primier on High End Jobs, who liked to PAY , but on some Jobs, I did use High Quality Finish Flat..and it came out great...

paintr56

Primer is the right way to go. You can use a heavy coat of flat paint and it will look good. The problem is it is not a quality finish it will set up the next job for failure if they try to use a paint with any sheen with out priming. The primer should be done to bare drywall so if you paint with out priming you are cheating the home buyer. Many builders do not care about this and painters get the bad reputation.

When a paint says it does not require a primer that does not mean it takes the place of a primer only that it will stick to the drywall and not flash. The next paint could very well flash.

Let your conscience be your guide.

Jim Bunton

Joewho

C'mon guys. Primer is a necessary product, but we're talking drywall here. Not bare wood, windows, trim, metal or anything else, just drywall.

There are lots of "self-priming" paints (ie. pro mar) that can be used on drywall.

I personally prefer to prime. But again, in the competitve world of new construction you have to get with the game if you want to "take the job from the slob."

pro mar 400, thinned 25 or 30% will do just fine as a base coat and then full strenght for top coat. I've seen it done, many, many times. Remember, after the spray, you will be going around with a roller for touch-ups anyway.
I can stand around and bark about how that sucks but in the end the builder, HO and painters were happy with it. If i'm not willing, I don't get the job.

EDIT: DISCLAIMER: The above scenario is usually associated with tract homes where the painter works for the builder, and one color. Most of the time, new homes are one color ceilings and walls. If it's a two tone job or a high end home, I will not bid if the above method has to be used. Don't shoot me.

AAPaint

Yeah....we've all seen the way builders do it. Maybe we should get THEIR asses on the bandwagon. As soon as painters stop offering to do one coat, no prime jobs, they'll have to do it themselves or pay to do it right.

It's funny cuz the GC can't get away with telling the electrician or plumber to do a half ass job....but painters will accept it every time.

No offense to anyone. I'm sure EVERYONE here has done this kind of BS work before, and I don't hear any of you advocating it as "the way to go"....We just need to get the rest of the industry up to par.

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-AAPaint

AA Quality Painting & Pressure Washing LLC
Jacksonville Painters
Jacksonville, FL.

ProWallGuy

I think I'm pretty safe in assuming no one in this thread has ever tried to install a wallcovering over a painted substrate that wasn't primed. Guess what happens in that scenario?

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Digital Murals Installation

slickshift

No, but I've had repaints self destruct because the original job wasn't primed
Or had to jack up the price to fix a failure

You might "get away" w/o using primer, but in way too many cases it hoses the homeowner (who has to pay me to remove the old and do it right), or the repainter/paperhanger (who didn't catch that little tidbit in the estimating) later

Please stop that
Use primer

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Signature Quote

Quote:

Originally Posted by ModernStyle I have never used this crap before and I pray to the paint gods that I never have to use it again, I would rather use Behr

metomeya

I always tried to explain primer as a flipped gloss.

A gloss paint seals (in a way) the side of the paint closes to you (no pores to penetrate).

A primer (that are also sealers which 95% are) seals the side of the paint facing the drywall, and has a tight grip on it as well.

I think back in the day, sealers and primers were separate for drywall.

So if you are using flat as a primer on drywall, when you put paint on top it will seep thru the flat and into the drywall.

This is also the reason why wallpaper can be really hard to remove. If the surface wasn't primed, the glue seeps deep down into the drywall. Making it a pain to remove.