primer only on new drywall ceiling - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

georgia dawg · 01-23-2007, 08:31 PM

We just put some primer (1st step) on raw drywall on the ceiling of a newly constructed house. It looks pretty good. No one will ever touch it or get anything on it. Anything wrong with not topcoating it with anything and leaving it as is? ( Of course, walls will be primed + 1 coat paint)

**ProWallGuy** · 01-23-2007, 09:34 PM

Do it right ....paint it.

BMAN · 01-23-2007, 10:01 PM

Primer will age faster and break down. It will fall to the gorund as dust. Plus change colro over time from light. I would leave it. If you dont want to be in business very long.

DelW · 01-23-2007, 10:31 PM

Are you getting paid to just prime it, or are you getting paid for prime + top coat ?

LennyV-NHSNOLA · 01-23-2007, 11:24 PM

I'm surprised you are trying to get away with one coat of paint on new construction.

jamieharrington · 01-24-2007, 07:37 AM

It all depends on what you used for primer? If you used paint that says primer on it.. Then yes the primer will age and fall, chip and crack. If you used a top coat as a primer.. sprayed it and back rolled it.. you should be fine.. As a new constuction painter mtself. I know you have to do this to make money. It is true no one will ever touch it! and it will be fine.. I started doing this about 6 years ago and every one of them are still in great shape! Just use a good top coat as a primer, spray and back roll and you'll be fine!

PlainPainter · 01-24-2007, 08:01 AM

Before I knew better - I always used ceiling paint as primer on drywall.
Actually I am sitting right under a ceiling that was finished to a level 5 finish - one coat of ceiling paint, and it it absolute perfection. Now if this was plaster - I'd say prime it. I'd prime and topcoat anything anyways. You won't have to worry about cuts being to weak if you do this.

**slickshift** · 01-24-2007, 05:11 PM

Primer makes a lousy topcoat
It won't last, or look good for long
And you're hosing your H/O as I'll have to charge them extra to repaint because of the crappy 1/2-azzed job you did
They'll need to repaint sooner, and it'll take me longer and more materials to do it

Then there's the ethical side...
...and the image of painters that you're degrading...

So, yeah...there's lots wrong with "...leaving it as is..."

Do it right
Paint it

georgia dawg · 01-24-2007, 05:19 PM

Thanks for the help. Although the primer looks good now, I now realize that it won't hold up by itself over time. We're going to topcoat with some paint. As a spec builder of smaller sized homes, I'm not trying to be cheap, but I'm not building the Taj Mahal or auditioning for This Old House, either. Just trying to be efficient with average to good quality.

**slickshift** · 01-24-2007, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamieharrington

....If you used a top coat as a primer.. sprayed it and back rolled it.. you should be fine..

That is incorrect
Top coats make lousy primers
Well, maybe "you should be fine" means "you'll be long gone when it fails"

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamieharrington

I started doing this about 6 years ago and every one of them are still in great shape!

Then you are seriously lucky, are not aware of the failures and/or problems that have occurred, or none have yet because none have had repaint attempts yet

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamieharrington

Just use a good top coat as a primer, spray and back roll and you'll be fine!

That is a seriously horrifying statement

PlainPainter · 01-24-2007, 05:22 PM

Why not go with one of those contract grade selfpriming flat paints?

-plainpainter

George Z · 01-24-2007, 05:56 PM

There is no reason to re invent painting.

Use primer as a priming coat.
Use finish paint as a finish coat.
Two finish coats would be best.

Isn't it funny how these (coating) systems work?

Joewho · 01-24-2007, 05:57 PM

There's always two schools of thinking on this issue. What "I would do" would depend on the job. For the longest time I would be 100% against it and against 1 coat of finish paint or even contractors paint. (self priming).

But later on I thought I should be flexible to meet any painting situation. The hardest part of doing new construction is letting go of the responsiblity. If the GC wants it like that then that's what he gets.
And it's his responsiblity. If the home owner wants to know how many coats of what, they go to the GC because I'm a sub, the GC is my customer, not the homeowner. I like to stay away from these jobs and go in later to repaint them, but I have done them. Dont' expect a GC to represent the paint job as his. The HO thinks you have to talk to him only because he's the boss, not because it's a one coat job. LOL. Also, expect that the GC is making money on your bid too. Not trying to down builders, they genertate work and jobs. It's just how the business works.

If you're trying to get one coat on and still make it look good use self priming, flat paint. Your paint store will have standard, new construction paint that will cover in 1 coat. They are usually a "high build". They are made for what you want to do.

George Z · 01-24-2007, 06:04 PM

If you're trying to get one coat on and still make it look good use self priming, flat paint. Your paint store will have standard, new construction paint that will cover in 1 coat. They are usually a "high build". They are made for what you want to do.

If you can explain to the homeowner she is getting screwed, go for it.
If not, I am tired of being guilty by association (painters!)

AAPaint · 01-24-2007, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Z

If you're trying to get one coat on and still make it look good use self priming, flat paint. Your paint store will have standard, new construction paint that will cover in 1 coat. They are usually a "high build". They are made for what you want to do.

If you can explain to the homeowner she is getting screwed, go for it.
If not, I am tired of being guilty by association (painters!)

Amen George. It made sense to me why the companies I worked for before never painted many of these fabulous new houses except for when they were built. It's because they did the horrible one coat colored flat deal, and considered touching up a second coat. Their work was so far from quality it wasn't even funny.

So, I would say if there are two schools of thought on painting they would be: One that follows the science behind painting and does it right, and one that does whatever they think looks good and can get away with. It's quite difficult for a company to be both.

When the homeowner says "what company painted this house" and it's a crap one coat job with your name on it. It doesn't matter that the GC is your customer. The HO is ultimately the customer you want. This is where the profitable repaints come from. Not more work where you can't afford to do it right for a GC.

I would love to see painters across the board raise their prices and refuse to do things that are outside of manufacturer/industry standards for specific products/applications.

If painters would get with the program we would all make more money and demand more respect. Until we do that you will continue to hear "well, I was just gonna paint it myself...."

Paul_R · 01-24-2007, 09:57 PM

Howdy, I am new to this forum, and I am learning already. How about this for a builder shortcut. I decided that in a moment of down time I would paint my laundry room. I had to do some minor drywall repair, and had to clean some spider crap and such off the ceiling and walls. Well to my surprise, my stomp texture on the ceiling started to dissolve. Whoa, apparently it had never been painted at all. I am just wondering, haven't checked yet to see if the rest of the house is that way too. The house is 6 years old. Is it typical to find this situation? Thanks a bunch, Paul R.

Kashmir · 01-26-2007, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joewho

There's always two schools of thinking on this issue. What "I would do" would depend on the job. For the longest time I would be 100% against it and against 1 coat of finish paint or even contractors paint. (self priming).

But later on I thought I should be flexible to meet any painting situation. The hardest part of doing new construction is letting go of the responsiblity. If the GC wants it like that then that's what he gets.
And it's his responsiblity. If the home owner wants to know how many coats of what, they go to the GC because I'm a sub, the GC is my customer, not the homeowner. I like to stay away from these jobs and go in later to repaint them, but I have done them. Dont' expect a GC to represent the paint job as his. The HO thinks you have to talk to him only because he's the boss, not because it's a one coat job. LOL. Also, expect that the GC is making money on your bid too. Not trying to down builders, they genertate work and jobs. It's just how the business works.

If you're trying to get one coat on and still make it look good use self priming, flat paint. Your paint store will have standard, new construction paint that will cover in 1 coat. They are usually a "high build". They are made for what you want to do.

You are totally right. Almost every paint manifacturer has a primer-finish paint. If the manifacturer sells it as a primer-finish for drywall specifically---whose fault is it it if the paint fails???

LennyV-NHSNOLA · 01-26-2007, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul_R

Howdy, I am new to this forum, and I am learning already. How about this for a builder shortcut. I decided that in a moment of down time I would paint my laundry room. I had to do some minor drywall repair, and had to clean some spider crap and such off the ceiling and walls. Well to my surprise, my stomp texture on the ceiling started to dissolve. Whoa, apparently it had never been painted at all. I am just wondering, haven't checked yet to see if the rest of the house is that way too. The house is 6 years old. Is it typical to find this situation? Thanks a bunch, Paul R.

Sounds like your builder or his/her painter took some shortcuts.

PlainPainter · 01-26-2007, 10:25 AM

Working for a G.C. on new construction and working for homeowners on re-paints are two totally different animals. If this leads to bad paint jobs - it is the fault of G.C.'s - I know they're always trying to chisel me down to nothing. What do people honesty expect? You can make lots of money working for contractors - but it is a totally different world. You just can't do high end painting that you are use to with high end customers. I use to do apartment repaints for landlords and my technique is totally different for that as well - and I made great money, and they were good jobs - but not totally high end work. Ultimately it's the customer and their checkbook that determines the quality in this business - and not everyone is going to want or need extremely high end painting. I see nothing wrong with this nor do I see anything wrong with filling this niche if you are efficient at it.

-plainpainter