Opinions needed - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

Robie · 06-01-2008, 05:35 PM

This is what I've got...
35 year old house at the beach
Vertical tongue and groove siding on north face.
Siding was originally stained and then painted 25 years ago
Entire exterior painted 2 years ago with SW Super Paint
Spot primed with SW A100

Last year paint started to peel off. This is a good, repeat customer of mine and since I had to do some other work requiring a boom lift, suggested we take care of the paint while I had the lift.
I've never seen paint peel like this. It's coming off in sheets and the wood is moist underneath. I don't see any signs of a primer or even stain for that matter.
What's weird is the whole wall is 26 wide x 37 high and only one section is doing this but it's the whole section. The customer can't recall anything different done to that section versus the rest of the house.
Here are some pics...
Any clues as to what caused this?
Thanks.

**slickshift** · 06-01-2008, 06:34 PM

Now that looks familiar
North side
Beach house
Wet wood
25 year old paint, topped with new latex two years ago
Yup

It could be a few things
There are most likely a few factors involved
Although I suspect inadequate venting and a wet house may also be at play here, for sure the substrate was questionable at the time of the last paint job two years ago, and was improperly prepped and the correct products were not used
The fact that it lasted two years and only affected the north (lack of sun and moisture release) side merely means it was close to working, but no cigar
It didn't make the cut on the Rubicon side
In that case the newer paint is pulling off all the rest of the coatings underneath

If it's a "wet house" and exuding moisture then it's "pushing" the coatings off If the stain and original paint job were oil based, and not stripped, then that would make sense
"Wet" houses are common in beach areas, were former summer homes are DIY "winterized" and every last vent and crack are sealed, the place over insulated, and they often have a damp basement or crawlspace...often just sand not a slab

At this point, I suspect both

painterman · 06-01-2008, 07:01 PM

I would think a moisture meter could tell you alot.

Robie · 06-01-2008, 07:50 PM

Hey Slick...I think you hit the nail on the head. The 10 x 12 or so area that this has affected the most is the 2nd story master bath. The enclosed tiled shower is at the north wall. I ripped out all the old tile shower and some tile flooring 2 years ago and re-built everything. Their had been no cement board used and the north and east wall were in sad shape with water damage from it leaking over the years. I even had to sister some 2 x10's on the overhang as they were that rotted. And though the insulation was wet, I didn't see any damage on the sheathing, or see traces of water.
I looked through my records and this repair was done 02/06. The painter did his thing in April of '06.
Soooooo, is it safe to assume that the cedar boards have retained some moisture with a fresh coat of paint 2 months after this repair? The sun never hits it and with a good rain now and then, water gets trapped behind very loose paint?
If you agree with this analysis...I have a few questions on continuing with the repairs.

**slickshift** · 06-01-2008, 08:18 PM

It may have been too wet 2 months after the repair
Wet insulation would be more than enough

It still seems too wet (now) though
But you are correct once the protective barrier is broken all bets are off
With little sun the wood under the failing coating could stay wet for days...or much longer
I'm just worried there is still an interior moisture problem
Can you check that w/o any destruction?

ewingpainting · 06-01-2008, 08:53 PM

I had a similar experience, the paint was pealing off in sheets. I had 20 houses effected by this at the same time. It was not any whole house only cretin areas would peal. The house were stucco though. it came to be through testing that the paint had pin holes due to the paint failing. moisture was getting in through the pin holes causing the coating to lift. I had to put an oil base primer on to block it from any moisture to be able to penetrate it. You could have your Sherwin Williams rep to take a look at this for you. They will more likely tell you it was caused by the moisture and there coating did not fail. some time getting an outside lab to test a sample of the paint you pealed off will give you a true test.

mjay · 06-01-2008, 10:23 PM

All the factors: Substrate, texture, location, dictates that the house should receive a semi-solid stain at most.
Any film-forming finish on that siding, in that location, with those house mechanics will fail prematurely. Your fighting a losing battle applying paint or solid stain to that house.

Robie · 06-01-2008, 10:55 PM

Quote:

I'm just worried there is still an interior moisture problem
Can you check that w/o any destruction?

I have to replace 4-6 boards as they are too rotted to proceed.
I will have a chance to at least look at the sheathing.

This is pretty much a seasonal beach home and this particular bathroom doesn't see that much use (if steam and the like are of any concerns)

Once I had 15-20 square feet of paint removed on Friday, the wood seemed significantly drier today. I worked again today, so it had a short time to dry in good weather and wind.

I'll post what the findings are after I get some boards removed.
Thanks for the input.

Here is a pic of the wall before I started scraping/peeling.