daArch

I recommended a painter for a couple of interior rooms that I will be hanging. When I show up today to strip them, the homeowner tells me that he was "awfully expensive" at $4000 to paint two interior rooms for just ceilings and a little trim. (she is NOT aware of the amount of work that needs to be done). She went on to say that he's "lucky" because the painter she used for the exterior is busy until December. Now, she told me about these guys when I gave the estimate. They were "reasonably priced" . The workers did not speak a word of English and were up ladders in FLIP-LOPS !! But, she says, "I was perfectly happy with the job they did". Now mind you, this is an OLD home in the historic district of this classy Massachusetts town.

So walking back and forth from my van I noticed the quality of the work these guys did:

Here are the clapboards RIGHT NEXT to the from door:


and here are the floor boards of the main entry porch:



Sorry, but destroying clapboards with circular grinders has always been a pet peeve of mine, but I understand it in places that aren't seen or so high up you can't tell. But seriously, "grind and paint" right around the formal front entrance on a beautiful historic home ?? I tried to get some shots of the gouges in the trim from the scrapers, but my lens fogged up. No wonder they were "reasonable".

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Wallcovering Installations by Bill Archibald|paperhanger|Eastern Mass|Greater Boston Area

Chris Johnson

That's a crime

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Chris

neolitic

But they were polite, and didn't pi** in the bushes!

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(Sorry....it seems there really are dumb questions)

Tmrrptr

That's a shame to destroy old wood like that. Especially at front entry.
Too bad they just didn't do a quick scrape and blast.
r

regal

wow.....

jack75

Obviously, the workers didn't care, their boss didn't care, and ... so did the homeowner.

[quote=daArch;311874]... the homeowner tells me that he was "awfully expensive" at $4000 to paint two interior rooms for just ceilings and a little trim... QUOTE]

She was right, wasn't she?

chris n

But they were polite, and didn't pi** in the bushes!

Wanna bet!

Steve Richards

She's obviously (very) easily satisfied.

So when your-recomended painters came in @ 4k (no doubt they did a fine job, BTW...but also did it way better than she'd have considerered "acceptable") ...I think you're lucky she didn't send them packing, and you along with 'em.

daArch

I didn't want get into the work necessary on the two interior rooms in the initial post - that wasn't the point. Here's the scoop.

Date on house is 1892. Horse hair plastwer on wood lathe. She wants ceilings painted semi-gloss (don't ask). BUT, they are cracked and lots of keys broken. Would be cheaper to overlay with 3/8 drywall. But no, they gotta repair. Who knows how many pounds of plaster buttons needed. (each room about 12 x 15). Water damage on outside walls (mold and mildew under paper I stripped). Many other repairs needed on walls, especially on ones I'll be papering. Total of four doors and five windows. Sash cords need replacing. Paint is now JUMPING off trim. (Under the existing three layers of paint, looks like unsanded dark stain with varnish/poly/shellac) Large baseboard. Picture molding at ceiling. These rooms need EXTENSIVE work. I do not think they've been touched in 25 years. He brought his price down a little, but he and his brother are still expecting two weeks. They do good work. Thorough ! That's why I can recommend them with a clear conscience. Yup, they are on the higher end of the price scale, but good work by careful and thorough craftsmen does cost.

We've recommended each other for many jobs. I just hope his customers have praised me as highly as I have heard about him.

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Wallcovering Installations by Bill Archibald|paperhanger|Eastern Mass|Greater Boston Area

daArch

Yes, looking at the exterior, one must realize she has a lower standard of acceptance than I am used to, and that is why those painters continue to get away with it. She also was unphased with the high probability that they were undocumented foreigners not paying taxes and not fully insured . ("well I have home owners liability insurance"). Again, attitudes like this allow the illegals to steal our work and raise our taxes and insurance premiums.

She will receive from myself and my painting buddies, a better job than she is used to. I'm sorry, I can't lower my quality to what's acceptable by the customer. For one, what if I use her as a reference ? And a prospective customer sees it? Not to mention my own pride in my work. I've been trying hard to get a toehold in this part of this town. It's the third house in six months. I ain't gonna lesson my quality and let that reputation spread. Let it be known that me and my little circle of contractors ain't cheap, but boy does our work look GOOD.

The painters haven't done any work yet. They start Monday, that's why I stripped yesterday.

Now, I gotta say, looking at my posted pictures, the grinder marks on the clapboards don't look as bad in the picture as they do in real life. It was tough getting the light right to show reality.

I also wonder what happened to all the lead paint they sanded off?

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Wallcovering Installations by Bill Archibald|paperhanger|Eastern Mass|Greater Boston Area

A W Smith

they make quarter inch drywall for veneering over old work. i have used it. it's hard to get but its available,

Steve Richards

Well Ma'am...I'm afraid we'll have to strip all this trim to bare wood, and then start all over

Are you sure..I was really only wanting it freshened up a bit.

I'm sorry Ma'am, we have to do this the correct way. That's why our quality paint jobs typically last 30 or 40 years.

But I'm already 87

Do you want to go to your grave knowing the trim in these bedrooms might start peeling someday?

Well, Ok...I suppose I could eat dogfood for the next few months so I can afford to pay you

Glad you see it my way, Ma'am

PlainPainter

You know - I'd be tempted to do crap work for the right price, if I knew beforehand what the homeowners are like. Realisticly, that same lady - if an american had done that work - she would have threatened lawsuits. I've done absolutetly perfection interior work - and still had homeowners with flashlights with their noses stuck to the wall asking what the rippling was, can you believe it? It's really tough working residential - and rich snobby towns, man - that's where you get the most disprespect sometimes. I've gone back and forth about the illegals from hating them personally to realizing they're just poor folks trying to make a living, now firmly back hating their guts - they know what they're doing to us, and laughing about it.

KellyPainting

I do allot of historic restoration also.... and prefer circular sanders, but you got to know how to use them...the pic looked like they just kept it in the same place for too long..... I actually think scraping an old exterior ruins the finish even more... gouging the wood... making scrapes and indentations. The key to circular sanders is to palm sand any swirls after, but ofcourse, that level of prep is more money and is not always chosen by the customer. I am going to keep that picture of the marks if I may..... would like to show homeowners what level of craftsmanship to avoid.

daArch

YES ! Circular sanders are NECESSARY at times, but you GOTTA know how to use them and THEN follow with a palm sander or the like.

Let me email you the originals with my
© 2007 billarchibald.com

on them

You can print them up, but I DO want credit, in case they are looking for a quality hanger

Do I have your e-address? give me a call or PM me.

-Bill

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Wallcovering Installations by Bill Archibald|paperhanger|Eastern Mass|Greater Boston Area

daArch

I hear what you are saying, but there IS a happy medium between ripping the customer off with CRAP work and ripping the customer off by going completely overboard.

and BTW, this lady ain't gonna be eating dog food too soon. I won't get into details, but you needn't worry about her. IMO, owning a historically significant home carries a responsibility.

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Wallcovering Installations by Bill Archibald|paperhanger|Eastern Mass|Greater Boston Area

regal

does anybody worry about lead dust from circular sanders? Im paranoid dry scraping at times.

Steve Richards

Sometimes I just come here to have fun...please bahr with me

regal

excellent!

KellyPainting

Coffee in one hand... cigg in the other...who's got time to worry about lead paint?