How to bid starting out - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

B's_Painting · 08-29-2007, 08:44 PM

I need some tips on bidding. I seem to be low but I need the work. For example I just painted a kitchen, a hallway, three bathrooms. I feather dusted the 3bathrooms and the hallway, the hallway and one bathroom also had wallpaper that I removed. I did this in 28hrs and I spent 200 on materials. $1150, that is all I had the nerve to bid! This was my first job on my own this time. I started my own business 3 years ago and faied cuz I charged too little and people (friends I did work for) lied about amount of work agreed upon and I lost my a$@ on a few jobs in a row and I was broke. I want it to work out this time so any tips would help!

plazaman · 08-29-2007, 09:28 PM

Have you calculated your overhead expense?

bujaly · 08-29-2007, 10:15 PM

B's Painting... Let me advise you on one thing here, only because I'm still new to this site...
If you aren't a MASTER or PROFESSIONAL here, you're going to receive so many questions after every one of your posts if your so vague with questions. Like..."What's your overhead?"
"How many sq. ft?
Any trim or molding work?
Any doors? Flat panel or 6 panel molded..etc..?
Just some reliable, satisfactory , and unsolicited advice..

G3 Remodeling · 08-29-2007, 10:16 PM

First of all sounds like when you write our your estimate it needs to be stated that your estimate only includes whats written. Have them sign it and keep a copy for yourself and then have a change order aggreement...I usually charge $50.00 per change order. You might also call around to other paint contractors and ask them for estimates on certain things. I have moved a few times in the past few years and every market is different. I am a remodeler so I do many different things so I want to make sure I am not over or under bidding.

toddcla2002 · 08-30-2007, 04:26 AM

Welcome to the school of hardknocks. I recommend joining the PDCA or working for another paint contractor to learn the trade and doing community college classes to learn how to run a business. You should check out www.yourcostcenter.com to figure out your overhead. You should read E-myth contractor edition to learn what you need in place to run a business. This is a dog eat dog world. Are you top dawg?

Don't take my advice lightly. If you are serious about being succesful, do the above and if you still need help don't hesitate to contact me.

~todd

welovepainting · 08-30-2007, 05:16 AM

I myself highly recommend yourcostcenter.com to anyone or company that needs to determine estimate cost vrs actual. Yourcostcenter has helped me save money and cut cost where and when needed.

Also PDCA accepts monthy payments of $60.00 so if you cant swing the 700 all at once sign up for monthly payments. PDCA has a really kick but contractor college you can learn a bunch from.

B's_Painting · 08-30-2007, 05:48 AM

I have worked with several painting companies for the last 10 years. The guy I worked for the last three years told me the price he bid on every job since he knew I was into running on my own. Todd, I am top dawg! Just so u know. I am more than a pro I am the savior of any homeowner who has had a bad job done, not only cuz my work is great, but my prices are so cheap they can't say no, Thats y I am asking for advice on bidding and not on how to become a painter.

B's_Painting · 08-30-2007, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welovepainting

I myself highly recommend yourcostcenter.com to anyone or company that needs to determine estimate cost vrs actual. Yourcostcenter has helped me save money and cut cost where and when needed.

Also PDCA accepts monthy payments of $60.00 so if you cant swing the 700 all at once sign up for monthly payments. PDCA has a really kick but contractor college you can learn a bunch from.

Thanx I will check into this stuff!

B's_Painting · 08-30-2007, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G3 Remodeling

First of all sounds like when you write our your estimate it needs to be stated that your estimate only includes whats written. Have them sign it and keep a copy for yourself and then have a change order aggreement...I usually charge $50.00 per change order. You might also call around to other paint contractors and ask them for estimates on certain things. I have moved a few times in the past few years and every market is different. I am a remodeler so I do many different things so I want to make sure I am not over or under bidding.

That is true, I used to do jobs where I knew most of the people on a personal basis and I thought I could trus them, I was wrong!!! People are animals when it comes to money, I need to be more of one!

back@it · 08-30-2007, 06:15 AM

All this is good advice! Now, my 2 cents...

When I was a younger man just starting out, I would have a tendancy to price jobs according to what I thought was the right price! What I mean is this - after I figured my costs, etc. I would look at that number and either think "That seems too high, gosh, I don't think they'll pay that to have this work done..." or something to that tune! I too was losing my tail and couldn't figure out what was going on.

One day a (very successful) building contractor and I was talking about why I wasn't getting anywhere financially. He gave me some advice but one morsel that stuck out the most to me was "Raise your prices"! Now I gotta tell you, this seemed odd that a guy I was doing work for was TELLING me to raise my prices! From that day forward when I sit down and diligently figure ALL my costs for doing a job, I rarely deduct anything from the number - often times I ADD MORE! When a quote is given to Mr & Mrs Customer, who knows what they are thinking it is going to cost for the job? You are the EXPERT and (should) know what it costs to do the work. They just don't want to do it! They want to hire it done.

Bottom line is this - people who can afford to hire their maintenance work done on their home or business know and understand to a great degree what it 'costs' to do business. When a painter comes along and gives a dirt ball low price, the customer will think "I'm not sure this guy knows what he's doing...". Hang in there and don't worry about being too high - worry more about being too low!

B's_Painting · 08-30-2007, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by back@it

All this is good advice! Now, my 2 cents...

When I was a younger man just starting out, I would have a tendancy to price jobs according to what I thought was the right price! What I mean is this - after I figured my costs, etc. I would look at that number and either think "That seems too high, gosh, I don't think they'll pay that to have this work done..." or something to that tune! I too was losing my tail and couldn't figure out what was going on.

One day a (very successful) building contractor and I was talking about why I wasn't getting anywhere financially. He gave me some advice but one morsel that stuck out the most to me was "Raise your prices"! Now I gotta tell you, this seemed odd that a guy I was doing work for was TELLING me to raise my prices! From that day forward when I sit down and diligently figure ALL my costs for doing a job, I rarely deduct anything from the number - often times I ADD MORE! When a quote is given to Mr & Mrs Customer, who knows what they are thinking it is going to cost for the job? You are the EXPERT and (should) know what it costs to do the work. They just don't want to do it! They want to hire it done.

Bottom line is this - people who can afford to hire their maintenance work done on their home or business know and understand to a great degree what it 'costs' to do business. When a painter comes along and gives a dirt ball low price, the customer will think "I'm not sure this guy knows what he's doing...". Hang in there and don't worry about being too high - worry more about being too low!

Good for homeowners, how about for General contractors that have a ton of work that I want, but I know they don't want to pay for it.. Bye the way this is the kind of advice I think is good, some of the other advice was also, but some people get hung up on one persons assumptions thats all I was trying to get across. Thanx

PressurePros · 08-30-2007, 07:21 AM

B's, I'll cut to the chase and just be blunt. You will be out of business in less than a year with your pricing stance. Price NEVER wins for anyone but the person hiring you. Its like doing drugs. It seems good in the beginning.. you're busy, you're getting referrals (to other cheapskates).. maybe you even think of hiring a couple guys, then it happens. Taxes are due, the truck needs a transmission, paint got to that customer's Berber carpet, your mortgage is two months late.. the list goes on. You'll scratch your head and wonder how this could have happened since you have been working 50-60 hour weeks for 6 months. This is why 95% of new businesses fail.. No clue how much money it takes to run a business.

If you think billing at $100+/hr for a couple of guy is a crime, once again, you may as well get looking in the paper for another employer.

bujaly · 08-30-2007, 01:42 PM

Do you all recommend the yourcostcenter.com for one man operations?

back@it · 08-30-2007, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B's_Painting

...how about for General contractors that have a ton of work that I want, but I know they don't want to pay for it.. Bye

The very last word in your quote above is what I'd say!!!

Many GC's are like you say but there are a lot out there that WILL pay for GOOD quality painting. I have always said that builders and GC's get down to the "earrings" of the project and then want to beat a guy down down down on his price AND STILL WANT A "QUALITY" PAINT JOB!!! Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can. Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can. Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can. Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can. Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can. Those are the ones you want to run away from as fast as you can.

You get the message I'm sure!