Have a question about estimating - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

khpainter · 04-02-2006, 12:42 PM

I just joined this forum, have read a few posts, seems like lots of good information! So maybe someone can give me a little advice on my question. I am estimating a paint job for a fast food restaurant that requires using an elastomeric paint. The building will need to be primed because of a color change and the owner wants two coats of paint on top of that. I am located in NY (between NYC and Albany) and would like advice on what to charge per sq. foot. Normally I estimate by figuring how many hours the job will take. I started my own business about a year ago, it's going well, but I am still trying to improve my estimating skills.

George Z · 04-02-2006, 01:16 PM

"Normally I estimate by figuring how many hours the job will take."

That's your answer

**ProWallGuy** · 04-02-2006, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Z

"Normally I estimate by figuring how many hours the job will take."

That's your answer

Yep, then divide that by the sq ft if they want that number.

khpainter · 04-02-2006, 02:27 PM

I was hoping to find a way to compare the two. I estimated the job to be 208 hrs, so I wanted to get any advice on sq. foot pricing to try to compare to that. I know good estimating is something that comes with experience, I've done good estimates and I've made mistakes. I guess what I would really like to know are estimating tips that anyone might have. I know its mainly exp. and learning from mistakes, but any other tips? Thanks!

**ProWallGuy** · 04-02-2006, 02:42 PM

Start keeping track right now of all your tasks, and put it in a notebook called 'production rates'. At the end of each job, tally up your numbers, and re-average the rate. Personally, I have mine in units, and sq ft/ln ft. Units for doors, frames, windows, etc. Sq ft for wall surface, ceiling surface, etc. Linear ft for baseboard, chair rail, crown, etc. Along with these are difficulty factors, which go with height requirements, or anything that will make it harder or longer to complete.

Example, ( all hypothetical here) my rate for cut/roll 100 sq ft is 1 man hour. But this particular job will have to be done off ladders, so it adds a difficulty factor of 2.5. ( Because my historical data IE production rate for 100 sq ft off ladders shows me it takes 2.5 hours) So this 100 sq ft will take 2.5 man hours as compared to 1 man hour (which is for a difficulty factor of 1). See where I'm going with this?

If possible, get a copy of the PDCA's estimating guide. It ain't cheap, but will help you understand how to figure rates for things.

As I said above, I figure my price by time (production rate), and divide it by the sq ft if thats what they want to see.

zico · 04-02-2006, 09:28 PM

Of course everyone is different and every crew is different. But the objective for anyone managing a paint job is to ensure that all work approaches the production norm. It seems to me, the more you do this that it all comes down to how long does it take to do something. Piece work estimating or detailing all in-scope items, has an hourly rate associated to it. For example to paint a wall the production rate may be 100 sq ft/hr or 40 sq ft/ hr from a ladder. You will find that it all come down to how long does it take one person to do soimething and that one person better be like the next person and the person before them.

Having the dicipline to keep a record and finding the time to review your results is the only successful way.

JMGP · 04-03-2006, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProWallGuy

Start keeping track right now of all your tasks, and put it in a notebook called 'production rates'. At the end of each job, tally up your numbers, and re-average the rate. Personally, I have mine in units, and sq ft/ln ft. Units for doors, frames, windows, etc. Sq ft for wall surface, ceiling surface, etc. Linear ft for baseboard, chair rail, crown, etc. Along with these are difficulty factors, which go with height requirements, or anything that will make it harder or longer to complete.

Example, ( all hypothetical here) my rate for cut/roll 100 sq ft is 1 man hour. But this particular job will have to be done off ladders, so it adds a difficulty factor of 2.5. ( Because my historical data IE production rate for 100 sq ft off ladders shows me it takes 2.5 hours) So this 100 sq ft will take 2.5 man hours as compared to 1 man hour (which is for a difficulty factor of 1). See where I'm going with this?

If possible, get a copy of the PDCA's estimating guide. It ain't cheap, but will help you understand how to figure rates for things.

As I said above, I figure my price by time (production rate), and divide it by the sq ft if thats what they want to see.

Pro,

Thats exactly how I keep info and Bid... thats nice to see...

I mentioned that in another post that I would break an estimate down so some would understand better BUT... I didnt even think of directing them to the PDCA books...

That is a better solution... thanks!