Ethical?

boman47k

Recently quit working with a guy ( brother-in-law ). Whe he first contacted me, he said, "when I got work, you got work". His background in painting is not that extensive imo. Years ago, he mostly worked out of town on construction ( Gunite ). When he came in on layoffs or whatever, he would paint with some of his brothers, cousins, etc.. Now he represents himself as a lifelong painter so t speak. As far as I know all these kinfolk are still in the bucket, and I can't really see how they have much to show for all the time they have been in this occupation. I have my own ideas why but...
He had a brother with him shortly before I joined him. This brother had mostly painted for many years. "Boss" siad' " Larry is not coming back. Donna ( his wife ) said she would close this thing down if he came back. " Off and on ore statements like this. Was not long before Larry was back for a job or two, then he was gone again. " That'sit, no more Larry, I can't put up with him!" For awhile things were o..tolerable ( spelling? ). He raised me a dollar per in a matter of days. In a month or so of actual working I was raised to 60 per cent of the job. Few days later I was told 75 per cent! Next day it back to 60 per cent. Reminded of the 75 per cent, he said I will if you want to pay your own taxes. Hehhe, I declined and told him that was okay, he couldn't pay that much anyway.
We went to look at an outside trim job. Supposed to be my first job at 60 per cent. I told him we should price it at 15oo and stick to it. Fairly good sized job with some dental molding on the front. He dropped the price 500 ( I think it was). Wanted me to think about it overnight as it was my "first house". Next day I didn't mentioned, neither did he. I felt like Larry was back. Heheh, sure he enough Larry got that job. I got to sit home and wait for a call to the next job. Sitting at home got to be quite often. I would pick his mind and definitely concluded he had been lying to me about no work, no calls, etc..
One week after sitting at home he called me wanting to know if I was ready to go to work. I told him yes, I owuld come and look at the job. When asked what he had, it was just some painting this and that and some sheetrock. Sheetrock being the keyword here. He can't do it and neither can his brother. I let HIM wait and call me 3 times. Then I told him he didn't need me, they could handle it. I had goten sort of used to sitting at home while they worked. His response? " I hate that you feel that way."
I felt like the brother would be back and it would not work out. I was getting my feet wet actually doing work of this nature for the puplic and buying up things toward the end.
My question is, since I very few if any prior customers in the painting arena, would it be ethical to contact the few he has and let them know I will soon be set up and available to do home repairs including painting, and let them know I would appreciate it if I could list them as referrences?

Sorry about the long post, needed to get this off my chest. More later on why I quit and am glad I didn't do the trim on my "first house".

Brushslingers

First, you worked for family? Are you STUPID?!?

Second, Is it ethical? Who cares, I wouldn't do it though... i'd just find new customers and set out to kick your broinlaws bootie. Sounds like it won't be hard. Luck to you!

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Benn

boman47k

LOl! May be. Actually I was biding my time hoping I might learn something from this guy. Actually didn't learn anything common sense did not already tell me. Examples: When asked by a customer wha kind of paint to get, never reply with 'that's up to you, I'm just the applicator ( while walking off).

When the cheap contractor grade paint from L..the big box store just kind of smears over the bright colors in a home, seriously consider you might be trying to go over oil with latex even if this is suggested by the hired help early in the job. Whole trailer!

If you have a brother as a parner, and he gets into verbal arguments with customers, let him go or have a serious talk with him.

Do not think you can go into painting business thinking you can get a license, have two men on two differnet small jobs, and run around with a clipboard like a true contractor coming around with slurred speech talkin crazy about sharing the wealth by hiring others to do stuff you could have done yourself.

Don't take all the 'tricks of the trade' taught by kinfolk to heart. If painting windows interior or exterior, price the caulking. Don't just paint over the old and say caulking was not figured into the price! Heheh. His version of upselling ( price cheap to get the job then add the "extras"). Sometimes he wouldn't even do that, just paint right over. I call it painting scabs.

And why in the world would a painter tell someone the best way to remove texured ceiling is with a 2" putty knife?! heheh

Thought I would learn a little about pricing with him. Not! Not consistant with it.

I really don't think you should complain about the contractor in a derogatory manner if you subbing. The talk about the customer to the contractor.

If you sub a job out and can't caulk worth a ####, do not help the sub out by smearing what looks like (excuse my french) boogers on the windows especially if your voice is slurred and you acting a little strange. Let the man do his job.

Considering his customers, I don't really think they are wirth going after for the most part, except maybe one. HIs main ones are a couple of developers and rental folks that can kind of get what they want out of him at heir price. He had already mentioned that one of them might try to hire me away from him. I told him I thought they would be too cheap.

thom

Yes, it would be unethical.
Yes, it would create more headaches than it solves.

Start over. In the long run, you will be ahead.

You should know that family will allways win out over non-family. That's life. Don't hope for anything different or you will be disapointed.

boman47k

Had that in mind when I said I was biding my time. I was buying things in preparation ( van, more knives, covers, drop cloths, etc.) for the split and hoping to learn a FEW things. I try to not let this bother me. Actually I had told my wife the whole time it was going to happen. As far as the ethical part, I have sort of struggled with that, but I do tend to agree. Actually ethical or not it just seems somehow wrong. If one wants to set themselves up to higher standards than someone else, one should not resort to tactics that might expected from them. In a weak moment, I did contact one to let him know I would soon be available and would appreciate a good reference if needed. But! If I get started and they contact me... I would really have to think about it. I think I would be inclined to pass on the investors. We did one job for a lady that he had subbed from a contractor. Customers like that might be considered fair game. I would not be in the position of turning down much work, but I try to keep my integrity in tact.

joasis

The first big no no is NO PARTNERS, and the second is, you guessed it, NO FAMILY! And I should be talking since my son in law works for me, only because I can keep an eye on him,,,LOL

It took me a year of working alone, glorified handyman, before the phone started to ring. Two years before I could pick and choose my work, and had two employees.

Find a niche, and build a business if this is what you really want to do.

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boman47k

That is similar to what my goal would be.