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Determining Manhours for rolling vs. cutting - your suggestions would be helpful

7K views 9 replies 5 participants last post by  Zeebo 
#1 ·
I don't use SF to quote...rather, I determine the job by manhours (paint, prep, setup, drive time, etc) materials plus a mark up for overhead.

I'm pretty good at determining how many manhours it takes me to roll a smooth interior wall, but I'm still working on determining manhours for cutting.

I know every situation is different, for example, rolling and cutting a 12 x 10 bedroom is different than rolling and cutting a galley kitchen.

So let's keep it simple and talk about interior smooth walls. Let's say I will be painting a wall that is 60(L) x 8(H). That's 480 SF. Generally speaking, I can roll 350 SF per hour. So rolling that wall will take me approx. 1 hour and 20 min. I usually estimate "cutting" this wall to be about 50% of the roll time...so "cutting in" will take me about 40 min. By "cutting in" I mean cutting in the ceiling, the baseboards (assuming baseboards are a different colour) and both sides of the wall.

Bottom line, that wall would take me 2 hours to paint (cut and roll). this excludes any time for surface prep or set up. Again, I am just interested in the cutting time.

Does that ratio - 50% of the rolling time, sound too high for determine the cutting time?? It's a ball park estimate that I use for every job and for every room...it helps me simplify a formula...it's funny I have never really timed myself for cutting.

I know with time and experience, I will have a better sense, but this is what I use presently.

Your comments please. Do you have a formula? Thanks.

Zeebo
 
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#3 ·
Not a formula like that, a % of rolling
I add the windows and doors to the linear footage, and have rates for an avg. window and door
Unless it's unusual...I'll measure those and go linear

I also don't price by the foot, though I use that as a tool to help me determine price
 
#4 ·
Yes, I understand what both of you are saying. I used to use a LF calculation but got away from it because of sheer laziness. I use a LF calcuation for moldings, baseboards, door frames,etc. say 120 LF per hour. Maybe I should go back to that method. I just wanted something quick and easy.

Thanks for the info.

Zeebo
 
#6 ·
ProWallGuy said:
If you try to break down your production rates too much or too specific, you will go insane trying to track all of them. I use brush/roll as one rate. If it is a cut-o-rama, then I jack up the time, like 1.5, or 2X the normal.
Works for me.

Can you give me an example of what you mean by "use brush/roll as one rate"?
 
#7 ·
I know this sounds silly - but I have taken notes on how long it has taken me to roll a room and cut a room. Obviously conditions are different from room to room. But after a while I use a number that's higher than my average. So say - I have come to the conclusion that for every 385 sq. feet of gross wall space{area containing windows and doors} I can roll that in 1 hour. And in that same area I have about 1.5 hours of cutting time. So now I take the total area of a room - and figure my rolling time and cutting time. And if it looks cut up - I tack on more money.

-plainpainter
 
#8 ·
PlainPainter said:
I know this sounds silly - but I have taken notes on how long it has taken me to roll a room and cut a room. Obviously conditions are different from room to room. But after a while I use a number that's higher than my average. So say - I have come to the conclusion that for every 385 sq. feet of gross wall space{area containing windows and doors} I can roll that in 1 hour. And in that same area I have about 1.5 hours of cutting time. So now I take the total area of a room - and figure my rolling time and cutting time. And if it looks cut up - I tack on more money.

-plainpainter

This does not sound silly at all...I think taking notes is a very creative way to learn about how good you are...your skill level....as well as charging appropriate manhours. I too can roll about 350-400SF in one hour. I would then usually just cut the time in half and that would give me my cutting time. So 350 SF would demand 1 hour of rolling and 30 min of cutting. Maybe I am short changing myself?

I just came back from pricing a job this morning and I probably added on an extra 30 min by using the LF method to determine cutting time. Too long for me...I'm looking for something quick and easy.

Zeebo
 
#9 ·
Zeebo said:
Can you give me an example of what you mean by "use brush/roll as one rate"?
Here is an example, the room dimensions will be accurate, but the rates will be hypothetical.

10X10 bedroom, 1 3X3 window, 1 7X3 door

This is what I DON'T do:

Roll - 320 sq ft walls - roll 320 sq ft 1 man hour
Cut in - 40 ln ft ceiling line, 40 ln ft baseboard, 17 ln ft door, 12 ln ft window, total 109 ln ft cut in = .5 man hours
Total 1.5 manhours

What I DO do:

Brush/roll 320 sq ft walls, 1 door, 1 window = 1.5 manhours
I know that this is a basic bedroom configuration, and my manhours are figured accordingly. If the number of doors, windows, etc changes, or its a harder cut like heavy textured walls up against stained trim, then I adjust as needed.

If the room has 6 windows and 3 doors, then this is a 'cut-o-rama', and I adjust my 1.5 hours up by 1.5X or 2X = 2.25 hours or 3 hours, judging by the looks of it.

I try to keep it simple enough to use easily, but detailed enough to be effective.
 
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