2008 Nec

jrclen

The jury is still out in Wisconsin too on amendments to 2008. I believe the public hearings have ended now. I was able to relay my opinions to the powers that be. Now it's just wait and see. The state has a history of amending the NEC. AFCI's are not required here at all YET. I would like to see an exception for existing circuits and maybe even existing panels. But that's just me.

Electricmanscot

Here's a guy that you want working on your electrical system. Yikes!

As for the rest of the naysayers..What buch of whiney brats.

If you even used that block of cheese above your shoulders you would look at this as an opportunity to make more money. If I have to explain what that means you don't deserve to know.

Electricmanscot

I just read through the Ohio info. What a bunch of bunk. For you guys that think they are taking a stand against the manufacturers you are dead wrong. All they care about is the price increase on their bottom line. By they I mean the builders. They don't give a rats ass about the addtional safety these items will bring, they don't care about AFCIs, or TR receptacles, or burns and fires, they only care about their bank accounts. They mention adtional GFCI requirements too and MWBC changes as well. They just don't care about safety, it is obvious.

Thankfully we have a code that is about safety and the rops and the docs used to lobby the cmps proove that.

Look at the two proposals from Happoldt electric showing the "alledged" cost difference between the 2005 and 2008 code.

Why in 2007 would he only need two standrd arc fault breakers at $35.00 each but in 'o8 he would need 15 arc faults at $77.00 each???

Two bedrooms 2 arc faults?
So fo '08 the same two bedroom house is going to need 15 arc fault breakers. No way in hell that is true. And they do not cost $77.00.

The worst part of the whole thing is that he is wiring a house for 5-6K.. I'd rather work at Home Depot.

jrclen

I don't think anyone is taking a stand against anything. All I've seen are Americans voicing a personal opinion and last time I checked, that was still allowed.

Celtic

This is more than a "personal opinion" - it is a stand.....but maybe you hadn't seen the post

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jrclen

Ooops, missed that one. Kinda looks like a stand doesn't it?

Celtic

LOL

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InPhase277

You guys are a bunch of sissies. Jump on my back cause I don't put AFCI's in existing installations? Sheesh. Look, just because the code requires it at the behest of the manufacturers doesn't mean I'm some kind of jackleg for not falling in line. If I were doing new work, OK, I would have no choice.

But when someone calls and needs a receptacle for God-knows-what added in their living room, just why should I put it on an AFCI? Besides that, where do you find an AFCI that screws into a fuse panel? Do they make them for FPE panels? How about American Switch? Am I supposed to refuse to do the job because the HO won't upgrade to a panel that can accept an AFCI?

And, for that matter, here there is no locally adopted code standard. There isn't even a building inspections department! I can use the 05 Code, or the 84 Code for that matter.

InPhase277

Celtic

Settle down before we lock you in a closet.

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InPhase277

Too many here would have to come out of that closet before I would fit.

InPhase277

Electricmanscot

Since the code is not even applicable in whatever southern backwoods redneck town you are in why are you arguing about code issues.

The rest of us professionals have a code to comply with. It is mandatory law not an option.

And yes if I go wire an outlet in a living room then yes I am required to install an AFCI breaker for that outlet. Just as if I install a receptacle in a bathroom I am required to GFCI protect it.

InPhase277

It is only "mandatory law" if it is adopted, wuss. And I am "arguing" code because about 97% of the code is for safety purposes, while the other 3 % is just fluff that is imagined by the manufacturers. I am not going to use the crap unless it is necessary and absolutely, positively mandated. As yet, it isn't. I know it makes you feel like a big man to flame me for not buying a $40 breaker that I can't use in most panels here anyway.

So tuck your nuts back into your panties, and go back to cornholing the poor chap that holds the license that qualifies you to do 'lectrical work.

InPhase277

Celtic

You've got some major anger management issues, a Napoleon syndrome, Oedipus complex or some other affliction.

Calling people "wuss" and "sissies" is pretty a ridiculous technique to try and get your point across - don't you think?

Take your meds and relax a bit....no one is out to get you.

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InPhase277

Why are you guys jumping me? I don't get it. I mean, I say I don't use AFCIs 'cause I don't have to. But you guys, like good little drones, take the newest, widely un-adopted, NEC to be the Gospel Truth, and I become some kind of jackleg? That's what wussies do. Take a look:

Electricnamscot says:

" Here's a guy that you want working on your electrical system. Yikes! "

Yikes? How can I not take a defensive position? Take my meds? Are you kidding? I am not, nor have I ever been a hack, but some mindless tw*t is so enthused that the NFPA has been paid a dump truck full of cash to push the AFCI issue, that suddenly I shouldn't be allowed to do electrical work. How can one not be defensive?

InPhase277

Celtic

Calling folks wuss and sissy isn't really defensive...rather the contrary.

If the name calling in your knee-jerk response to questions....

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InPhase277

It wasn't a question, it was an attack. Besides I didn't write it as a knee-jerk reaction, it was more like "polite smart ass-ity". If it were otherwise, there'd have been expletives and it would have sounded more like "yeah...well... you're a big... stupid. Annnd, and you're mother's a a... roofer..."

You still haven't answered: what is so bad about not using AFCIs? I mean, I've more or less been called a hack for it. If and when the local codes require it, I'll have no choice. But until that time, I have a choice, and I have chosen not to buy an overpriced, overrated, and most likely unusable (in a customer's fuse panel that is) breaker. Why does that make me a jackleg?

InPhase277

Celtic

I don't recall having called you a hack and/or a jackleg.

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Electricmanscot

This statement speaks for itself and backs everything I have said.

You sell your $3.50 breakers and make a few extra bucks on the markup. I'll be selling $40.00 breakers and laughing all the way to the bank.

Thanks for pointing out my panties, they are pretty hot.

Electricmanscot

You made it sound like you were thumbing your nose at the code. THAT makes you a jackleg, whatever the hell that is.

If you have the choice not to use them then what the Fkuck are you bitching about.

Electricmanscot

Show me the proof.