Taking Heavy Fire!! - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 01:16 PM

Soo...After much ado- I've been reading up alot of what you guys talk about here in the ceramic section...studying up a bit with the manufacturers and drifting away a little bit from what THD associates and trainings say...getting some weird looks and today i think reached a boiling point with a General Contractor.
The gentleman seemed genuine, but I decided to test his grey matter- since thats all that happens to me ALL DAY. he was wearing painters pants- so off the bat I figured I'd give it a shot- he was looking at our Absolute Black Granite going over a newly laid plywood subfloor. He was laying the hardibacker with screws- directly onto the surface of the subfloor- no unmodified in between...he looked at me and shook his head- he had no idea what I was talking about, never heard of it- and refused to do it...
I asked if he was a general contractor...he said yes...and asked him if he was licensed and insured...he said yes- he got pissed at this but I believe those questions were valid for him to think about what he was doing.
Just wanted a bit of reassurance I led him in the right direction- because there are associates who say if the subfloor is brand spankin new not to worry...but I haven't seen that brought up in the forums...

neolitic · 05-31-2009, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THDTile1229

Soo...After much ado- I've been reading up alot of what you guys talk about here in the ceramic section...studying up a bit with the manufacturers and drifting away a little bit from what THD associates and trainings say...getting some weird looks and today i think reached a boiling point with a General Contractor.
The gentleman seemed genuine, but I decided to test his grey matter- since thats all that happens to me ALL DAY. he was wearing painters pants- so off the bat I figured I'd give it a shot- he was looking at our Absolute Black Granite going over a newly laid plywood subfloor. He was laying the hardibacker with screws- directly onto the surface of the subfloor- no unmodified in between...he looked at me and shook his head- he had no idea what I was talking about, never heard of it- and refused to do it...
I asked if he was a general contractor...he said yes...and asked him if he was licensed and insured...he said yes- he got pissed at this but I believe those questions were valid for him to think about what he was doing.
Just wanted a bit of reassurance I led him in the right direction- because there are associates who say if the subfloor is brand spankin new not to worry...but I haven't seen that brought up in the forums...

You are right about the
technique, but if you are
gonna question my bona fides
in your store???

Maybe you should also take
some boxing lessons?

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 02:00 PM

Didn't mean to pick on the guy...I wanted him to think more about laying the backboard and the job as a whole correctly before costing the homeowner WAY more then job entailed...

neolitic · 05-31-2009, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THDTile1229

Didn't mean to pick on the guy...I wanted him to think more about laying the backboard and the job as a whole correctly before costing the homeowner WAY more then job entailed...

It's good that you want
to give good advice about
the products you sell.

Telling a guy how to run his
business is above your pay grade.

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:06 PM

I guess perfection wasn't included in his quote...

That was pretty insulting by the way Neo...
While my pay grade may not be contractor quality
Maybe I should hire a general contractor as a helper once I get my tools together...

(Note: No insult intended to anyone by that comment, but I certainly did not appreciate that comment...I hope you all understand, thank you)

neolitic · 05-31-2009, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THDTile1229

I guess perfection wasn't included in his quote...

That was pretty insulting by the way Neo...
While my pay grade may not be contractor quality
Maybe I should hire a general contractor as a helper once I get my tools together...

(Note: No insult intended to anyone by that comment, but I certainly did not appreciate that comment...I hope you all understand, thank you)

You don't understand the
reference.
It just means that isn't part
of your job.
The sailors rarely give unsolicited
advice to the admiral......
Don't know how you could take it
so personally.

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:23 PM

Duly noted

willworkforbeer · 05-31-2009, 04:26 PM

Seriously, I've known contractors that would have beat you into a coma for that.

SLSTech · 05-31-2009, 04:31 PM

I have to agree with Neo, if a HO or other asks for advice & you know the proper steps - then the advice is welcome. I walk into a store & start getting grilled on how or why I do something, it was nice knowing you & I probably won't be back (and that's me being extremly nice).

If said GC was advising a customer & stated it wrong, I would qualify my response as a question - shouldn't you... or as I recall per the TCNA...

Now the flip side is - if you don't know direct them to someone who does or to one of your wonderful DIY books, classes, etc... (Ok I am being nice with the statements, but as an employee you should think that way about your store & products)

Crock · 05-31-2009, 04:33 PM

Are you giving advice you have received from reading CT or does HD provide tile install classes for you?

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:38 PM

Well if it was a contractor who knew what he was doing it wouldn't have been said at all and probably would've been a pleasure helping the guy get his stuff together if he needed me.

Where I'm located isn't the greatest area- sometimes customers will come in trying to save a buck- and an inexpensive contractor can be just what the doctor ordered- but for a $6 bag of CustomBlend and a little extra work...I don't see how anyone could call it a no brainer and opt out of doing the job THE RIGHT WAY the FIRST TIME.

And if it gets this contractor to question whether he does the job right or not- and forces him to double check manufacturer specs...I've done my job

willworkforbeer · 05-31-2009, 04:41 PM

Yes the the tile guy is always my goto man for the right way to do things.

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:43 PM

Crock, I'm using the advice given to me via hardibacker installations specs:
www.holdenhumphrey.com/jh/hardibackerinstall.html

Also I will admit I did read a bit on CT before questioning it myself.

THD cannot afford a comprehensive training program, I asked if I would get any form of reimbursement for training through CTEF ($7,500 or so- plus its down south...and I would have to transfer down there for about a month)...but they only reimburse tuition to accredited colleges - Certifications will not be reimbursed

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:45 PM

WillWork, Whether or not he believes me- maybe he'll run it past a few of the guys who do tile as a trade...and hopefully come to the light and discover its not quite to spec and continue from there on out laying it to spec--

willworkforbeer · 05-31-2009, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THDTile1229

WillWork, Whether or not he believes me- maybe he'll run it past a few of the guys who do tile as a trade...and hopefully come to the light and discover its not quite to spec and continue from there on out laying it to spec--

Maybe he relys on his past experience. I hear Amway is looking for sales experts.

THDTile1229 · 05-31-2009, 04:58 PM

I was doing custom door hardware & weather stripping for only a few months before I came to THD, but I picked up on a few things (i have since forgotten)- couldn't handle the commute time from where I was to the hamptons...Because I didn't know what I wanted to do...I went back to school and applied for a job at THD...

They subsequently put me in the Lot to start with
Within 5 Months I was supervisor...

If THD Hired and placed their associates based on experience this gentlemen and I never would've even met in that aisle at that moment in time.

**Double-A** · 05-31-2009, 05:00 PM

There is always a way to direct a conversation around to the correct way. You've been given a few pointers, practice them gently.

As GCs are usually a very independent and hard-headed lot, I'd say that they are best approached from the standpoint of dollars saved and a job that will last longer than their business, i.e., from the side of ego. But, in all cases, "gently" is the watch word.

As a supplier, your job is to educate and recommend. You can't help what your customer does with that information.

We all know that unprotected sex can lead to unwanted pregnancies, that smoking is hard on the body and health, and that not wearing a seat belt can increase your risk for serious injury in an accident, but, do we all listen? Nope.

That means that you need to offer your information and let the dingus with the checkbook decide. Right is right, but "right now" and budget will always be more important to some people. All you can do is go in the back and use that expression my Grandpa used to, "Some people's children", while shaking his head.

Floordude · 05-31-2009, 11:50 PM

If I'm the one setting tiles, and he is the one in charge of setting the cbu, your damn straight I'm going to point out his errors quickly.

THDTile1229 · 06-01-2009, 12:13 AM

Pretty much how I reasoned it- after finally getting out of there a few hours ago it was a little heated- both here in the forums and in the store- quite a bit busy...but thanks for the insight...I'll find a different way of mentioning the specs if at all possible
I bring up product specs & 'Good, Better, Best' line of products when possible - definetly went about it the wrong way there but yea..lesson learned- thanks

PrecisionFloors · 06-01-2009, 10:12 AM

I commend you for giving a damn. Including yourself, I could count on one hand, with a couple of missing fingers, the number of HD/Lowes flooring "experts" that I could say that about. I take a very direct approach when I see someone (contractor or not) about to make a foolish mistake, concerning an area I happen to know quite a bit about. Sure, I've pissed off a few cocky GCs and so-called tile contractors, who think they know what they're doing.....I've also had many more than that thank me for educating them and ask tons of questions about other parts of the install. I can, without a bit of doubt, say that over the course of the years, I have saved some homeowner the nightmare of having a faulty tile installation to figure out how to fix. If the cost of that was some pissed off GC....price well worth it imo.

As far as being above someone's pay grade -

It should never be below a GCs pay grade to never stop learning, and give his/her customer a proper job. Period. If your pride is worth more than your finished product, get the **** out of my trade and go practice being a tile man somewhere where you can do no more damage to our industry. We have a hard enough time convincing potential clients that we aren't just another hack who can't take the time to learn how to do it right the first time.

(not aimed at anyone in particular)

Knowledge is available to all of those who seek it. Don't be too arrogant to think it can't come from a HD employee...or anyone else for that matter. You don't know what knowledge they may hold. Just food for thought.