Pricing Structure For Tile

PrecisionFloors

I agree with you there 100%. If you agree to a job for a set price, you don't then turn around and start bumping because you underbid it. But, again, this in part, is because of the mentality of cutting each others throat to get a job. Once they get the job, then they have to do it...."whoops didn't realize setting materials would cost that much.....better find a way to make more money."

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bwalley

If that is the case you let the GC know BEFORE you start the next job.

How good of a tile setter can you be if you don't know how much thinset you need for wall tile?

When a sub gives me a price, i bid the job according to that price, if he wants more money, he needs to bring it up BEFORE the job starts, not after.

IHI

Exactly, i've lost money a few times because of guys like that when trying out new subs. I'm used to "my guys" giving me a TOTAL out the door price...IF things come up after things are uncovered...like what my roofing subs would find, well then obviously nobody knew before hand, BUT it's in BOTH our contracts...mine to homie and sub to me that coveres unforseen circumstances. Here we're talking tile....by the time a project is ready for tile, there should be no hidden fee at all. There should be pictures/drawings/whatever of a pattern if need to and homie signs off on pattern/layout, and sub and i will walk through it step by step unless it's a basic shower surround which a retarded monkey could do, so long as they knew the right materials for applications

I still say something is amiss here, too much drama for a "typical" shower surround and price increases.

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JazMan

Apparently the deal was that the HO was supposed to get the thin set, which is dumb. Several other things should be talked about and included in the future.

However, $5.00 a ft for shower work is ridicules to put it mildly. He is cheating himself. And I say that thinking that is only for installing just the tiles, too cheap. Of course everything else is extra. Labor for a basic 3x4 shower should start at about or just under 2k, plus all materials, plus any demo, plus any corner dishes, any plumbing work, etc. That same shower will usually cost about 3k with standard no frills tile and basic prep.

At $5.00 a ft. to install just the tiles, I think you should go help him, buy him lunch and drive him home too. WOW, that is cheap. Is he really good?

Jaz

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Frank P

So a 60 s/f tub and shower @ $5.00 s/f = $300.00 ? He supplies the setting materials and everything else as a sub?

$5.00 s/f sounds like flat work prices, even then the minimum is $300.00

Sounds like its way too cheap and he doesnt have the margin in the job.

Mike Finley

Once again, I'm calling bull sh*t and labelling this another hilarious contractor talk thread.

It's a wonderful thing to get $100 a square foot for whatever work you do.

Now as always reality enters into it. During the last year I have been contacted at least 2-3 times every month from tile setters looking for work, often they have been from out of state, I think I've gotten calls from 1/2 the states in the union by now. I've also ran employement ads for carpenters and gotten a dozen tile setters looking to apply, and these are guys with more than 10 years as tile mechanics.

Reality is in my opinion there are a crap load of tile setters, plumbers, electricians, framers etc... out of work.

The only thing I'm saying is I don't think it would be too hard to find excellent tile setters at rates that would shock us all during these economic times.

So when I see the posts about FIVE DOLLARS!!!!!!!! Why I wouldn't set up my tile saw for less then $1000 cash and a BJ!!!!!!

It's a bit of an eye roller.

JazMan

Frank,

I think this thread is not about a tub surround, it is about a shower, big difference.

Jaz

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Frank P

Yeah, I think my day is getting the better of me. Not like any of you guys would understand LOL

AtlRemodeling

Since you seem to what to stick my business out at least you should again get all the information. Am I specifically licensed? No! Do I have a registered agent that I work with that is a close personal friend who is licensed? Yes. Is there a reason? Of course!

I started building houses at a very young age working as a superintendent for another contractor and did so for nearly 10 years. I eventually moved out on my own doing residential, commercial and retaining walls. I focused on retaining walls and did that exclusively for 8 years until a 40' high wall collapsed at a high school (it was discussed in a previous post IHI and since you seem to what to dig through every post of mine I am sure you can find it). The collapse and the ensuing 2+ years of law suits caused me to file bankruptcy.

In Georgia, you can not be a licensed contractor with a bankruptcy on file so does that make me a hack? Hell I could be a real hack, not permit anything and f-ck over customers right and left but instead I am doing the right thing by getting a registered agent. I have never advertised and every bit of my work comes from word-of-mouth.

Since I was exclusively doing hardscapes, most of the people in my rolledex are no longer working, changed numbers, etc. so we have been slowly building a team of subs who we can depend on. Have I called people in my area asking what to charge? You betcha! I called JF from this site and asked him about his fees for trim work. He is a trim and cabinet guy after all and I had a client that was also be interested in his services.

Did I post a thread on CT looking for a framer/siding guy? Again you betcha! When I first started everything was pretty much done in house (very similar to you from reading your posts) but on this project we had a large addition to do to a home. Could I frame it with my help? Yes Could I do it in a time frame that suited the project? No. Thus I was trying to find someone qualified to do the job which we did, completed the job and already have another remodel for the same client lined up for the first of the year and meeting with one of her best friends next week to give a proposal for her basement.

Do I do everything 100% correct? Hell no (show me someone who does and I will gladly follow in their footsteps) but that was the intent of the OP. I am trying to get work orders, sub contracts, etc in order so that I do not run into problems as we expand not to "whines" about a subcontractor or his versus my pricing. I was simply asking how the tile guys price their work (total, SF, LF, etc) so that I can most effectively set up a system for my company.

FYI, I did discuss the shower with my tile installer prior to the bid going out to our client. I gave him exact measurements, tile layout, etc. Part of the OP states that each time he is giving me a price it included something the last bid did not. I had his price in place BEFORE we quoted the job to the client he just did not go to the job to see it personally.

The only thing about this whole thing that pissed me off (other than your flame attack) was he asked the HO where the thinset was. The HO was not supplying materials except tile which she got at a good deal from his tile outlet center. The sub has always provided thinset and to ask the HO where any materials should set off anyone.

Again I say to you IHI that before you "get your knives out" get the whole story. You can either choose to be helpful or you can choose to be an internet blog troll. I think for the most part you should be more of the first and less of the second but if not that is your choosing. It will not bother me to hit the ignore button.

Oh and by the way your website link in your profile goes no where except "Server not found". Does that make you hackish?

IHI

Feel better?

I'll remove the internet sig soon for ya, but i'd rather have a dead sig than a website chocked full of other's work touting it as my own Besides, i never planned on becoming a millionare in this trade...how many millionare carpenters do any of us now....so you see this is not the profession to become rich. I did not bother renewing my website because i dont need it, just as i am done officially with yellow pages, all of these medium's supply nothing but hack customers and tire kickers, i'm over them, and to be honest, i could give a chit if i ever measured another cold call job....because guys like you who operate/d illegal will beat my price anyhow, and folks calling out of the blue typically dont give two ****s about what they're getting...they just want low price, and sadly, that is'nt me.

Good luck, have fun Al.

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charimon

WOW how much work do you get these days. I set and grout a "basic" shower in a bit more than 8 man hours another 1 to backer and you are saying $2000. Cool. need a Sub?
Can you get me more than one of these sets a year?

Craig

PM me with the next job

bwalley

I guess Michigan is in better shape than everyone says it is, how much does that work out per ft2 for labor?

jarvis design

Why worry about how much per sq ft?? I never give prices based on square footage, ever.

Its going to take x number of days to do the job. that number x my daily rate

Its going to cost this much for materails x markup

add these 2 numbers together and you got yourself a price.

Selling by the square foot gives customers a reason not to buy from you.
Everyone has heard of morons charging $5.00 a square foot to tile.
Do I want to compete with these hacks - no thanks.

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JazMan

I set and grout a "basic" shower in a bit more than 8 man hours another 1 to backer and you are saying $2000.

What does that include?What method? Are you using a waterproofing product or method? Wall board? Ceiling? Mud the floor? Mastic or thin set on walls? What kind of tiles? Upstairs or downstairs? Did you count the time to go get the materials? 8-10 hours, I'd like to see that, and the resulting work.

Jaz

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PrecisionFloors

It's funny and sad at the same time to see other contractors tear down another for getting a higher price.....good luck on your race to the bottom.

To hear it from you, Mike, is very surprising. I'm sure in this economy people aren't as quick to pull the trigger on a gold plated ****ter either....doesn't mean you should be begrudged for pitching 'em though

You talk about reality. I bet a dollar to a donut the last 10 bathrooms you did could have been done cheaper.

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Mike Finley

But, keep in mind lots (most) tile setters calculate a finally number off of computing it by the square foot and linear foot. They may come up with a final single number, but they got their mostly by square and linear pricing.

AtlRemodeling

This was all I was asking to begin with is how various tile guys get to their price. This was never about ripping the guy working for me or anyone else. I am trying to set up proper work orders and looking for the best way for that to be done based on the experience of others. No point in trying to re-invent the wheel.

Thanks to all that posted informative posts.

IHI

It's real simple Al, if your NOT going to have subs look at a job that you are putting together, you better realize you need to sell the job for at least twice what you THINK the "going rate is" for the simple fact your essentially putting words in somebody elses mouth. OR, you could do like the rest of us guys with less than 25 yrs of "construction experience do" when a job goes from being bid to hard numbers put to paper prior to contract, i call in all the guys that will be working on the job if i dont feel i can oversell (like when budgets are really constricted) this way there's no suprises....but what do i know, i'm just a dumb phuckstick with less expereince than you muhahahaha.

your asking for advice on the most basic principal of our work....yet you are touting yourself as knowing your stuff..interesting...VERY interesting. i hope when i get to as many yrs experience in the feild that you have, i dont start to revert too

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jarvis design

That is true. I guess as most of my work is complete renos, I have always gone with an "all-in" price. That being said, the stand alone tile jobs I have done have all been "all-in" as well.

When you do a quote for a bathroom do you give a total price or do you break it down? (I'm just curious)

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Frank P

I only use the S/F pricing as a rule of thumb, then I add for any extras and anything that looks like brain damage.

We are usually multi-tasking the hell out of every job to stay on budget and on time, so I only quote the whole job. Breaking it down makes it look like "remodeling a la carte".