Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile

 
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:47 PM   #21
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


No ditra? Why remove the T&G planks and put down new ones? Just because they are old?
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:57 PM   #22
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


That's one hell of a floor Angus. You could tile that thing in Saltines and they'd last for 200 years.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:58 PM   #23
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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No ditra? Why remove the T&G planks and put down new ones? Just because they are old?
Why Ditra? What does it offer that is so special?

3/4" T&G is a stronger substrate than individual planks.
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:00 AM   #24
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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That's one hell of a floor Angus. You could tile that thing in Saltines and they'd last for 200 years.
That's the point. However, it's not far off what the minimum specs are recommended by the "industry".
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Old 12-20-2012, 07:48 AM   #25
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


I like natural stone over look a likes as well. I did however find a pretty nice fake from Dal tile!
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:40 PM   #26
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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If you could sister in 2x10's on at least every other joist under the foyer, you'd be real close to the minimum. I'd remove the planks and add 3/4" T&G. An additional layer of 1/2" EGP and you are good to tile. If leveling is a problem, a mud bed fixes the issue in 1 step. If you are not confident with floating that much, or the floor height would be too dramatic, go with prime and self leveler. You could then do a thin crack isolation membrane using a liquid like Mapei Mapelastic CI or a sheet membrane like NobleSeal TS. Both are very thin and won't raise the floor height.

I'd definitely remove the planks, add T&G and the 1/2" ply. The rest is up to you but at least at that point your subfloor will be sufficient enough for whatever you install.
Pretty much exactly what I'd do. For a beginner I wouldn't even think about a mud bed if you have access to SLC. Follow the directions EXACTLY on the bag of slc! Do not use even lukewarm water - the warmer the water the less working time. A newbie needs all the time he can get lol. Considering the substrate flatness needed for stone and tight joints you'd be waaay ahead going that route.
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Old 12-20-2012, 02:28 PM   #27
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


With that spacing and span any type of fir 2x10 #2 or better is all ready stiffer than 1/720. If your old joists are a full 2" (roughsawn) thats even better
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:03 PM   #28
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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With that spacing and span any type of fir 2x10 #2 or better is all ready stiffer than 1/720.
Not quite, It's still in the L/680 range. And don't forget, L/720 is MINIMUM.
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Old 12-20-2012, 08:54 PM   #29
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


Angus you must be figuring in some insane live load on top of a 20psf dead load to come up with that.
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Old 12-20-2012, 09:15 PM   #30
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


Correct if I am wrong but i thought 1/720 only pertained to marble and 1/360 to tile?
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Old 12-20-2012, 09:24 PM   #31
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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Angus you must be figuring in some insane live load on top of a 20psf dead load to come up with that.
Nope. My handy-dandy national forestry chart gives me L/679 for

2x10
16 OC
11'2" unsupported span
douglas fir in good condition.
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Old 12-20-2012, 09:25 PM   #32
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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Correct if I am wrong but i thought 1/720 only pertained to marble and 1/360 to tile?
L/720 for natural stone
L/360 for man-made tile

He's asking about installing marble.
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Old 12-21-2012, 12:06 PM   #33
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


I get my span info from awc.org/calculator
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Old 12-23-2012, 09:44 AM   #34
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


Ok, now that we have the floor nailed down pretty well, on to selecting tile!

I have done significant research and received mixed reviews on marble vs. porcelain. At this point I think we are planning on a compromise...honed marble. We really like marble and the honed instead of polished will be a bit more tolerant of traffic.

With that in mind, I know that there is a whole range of quality when it comes to marble. Some marbles are very soft while some are relatively hard. We really liked a bianco carrara marble from Stone Partnership, Inc (NJ). Supposedly this company is very picky about the tiles matching and quality. However, the tiles also come a bit pricey compared to others we've seen ($15.69/square foot at the first store we had price it).

There are a thousand people out there selling honed white carrara...I've seen anywhere from $6/square to $20/square. How do I decide which one? I don't want to pay more for the same product but more importantly, I don't want to try to save a few bucks/tile and end up with a softer marble or lower quality stone. Any help is appreciated.
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:28 AM   #35
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


IMVHO, I rely on 2 things when trying to purchase the best possible stone for the best price. Relationships and/or careful inspection.

I used to have a long-standing relationship with a great supplier built over many years, and I just knew that they would get me great stuff.

Now, I just have to go.....and see the stone for myself. Trying to order stone sight unseen is difficult without that relationship. I just sent back 3 orders of Travertine before I finally went and put my hands on the stone I wanted.......in stock somewhere.

Go put your hands on the stone you will lay. You should be able to tell which is the good stuff. In my experience, bad stone is like bad breath........very obvious. If you look at lots of different stock it should become clear which are the good ones. Consistent sizing, consistent color, lack of extreme veining.....those are a few things I look for.

Good luck......and good choice.
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:36 AM   #36
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


The first cake of coke that some kid spills on the floor and etches it will make you regret putting marble in an entry, with kids, in eastern VA, by a river.
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:42 AM   #37
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


Here, buy one of these.

http://www.granitecitytool.com/clarke-floor-polisher
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Old 12-23-2012, 11:26 AM   #38
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


Thanks for the responses.

BlueRidgeGreen--Do you have any places where you can reliable get good marble? You are about 2.5 hours from me so if you have a reputable person I should contact for a price quote please let me know. I have only gotten a quote from Best Tile in Richmond. Also will be checking Morris Tile in Richmond as well as L&M Tile in Mechanicsville. I'm getting them to price the tile from Stone Partnership, Inc in NJ. They are higher end for price but but all accounts seem more selective with their process. Unfortunately, I am not sure I am qualified to really tell the difference in grades of marble and figure out whether or not a few extra bucks is worth the upgrade. I'm sure I could see the difference between the worst and the best, but in the middle would probably be tough so I'll take all the help I can get.

skcolo--Thank you for your input. Yes, I might regret this. But, I haven't found porcelain that we love and we do love this SPI bianco carrara so I'd rather risk having to replace it down the road.

Are one of those floor buffers necessary/beneficial? If that is the best way to seal and protect the marble to give it the best chance of survival, I have no problem buying one. I guess that is what I have to learn about next--how to protect this floor as best I can and keep it looking good as long as it can.

Thanks again!
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Old 12-23-2012, 11:40 AM   #39
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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Originally Posted by SMLWinds View Post
Thanks for the responses.

BlueRidgeGreen--Do you have any places where you can reliable get good marble? You are about 2.5 hours from me so if you have a reputable person I should contact for a price quote please let me know. I have only gotten a quote from Best Tile in Richmond. Also will be checking Morris Tile in Richmond as well as L&M Tile in Mechanicsville. I'm getting them to price the tile from Stone Partnership, Inc in NJ. They are higher end for price but but all accounts seem more selective with their process. Unfortunately, I am not sure I am qualified to really tell the difference in grades of marble and figure out whether or not a few extra bucks is worth the upgrade. I'm sure I could see the difference between the worst and the best, but in the middle would probably be tough so I'll take all the help I can get.

skcolo--Thank you for your input. Yes, I might regret this. But, I haven't found porcelain that we love and we do love this SPI bianco carrara so I'd rather risk having to replace it down the road.

Are one of those floor buffers necessary/beneficial? If that is the best way to seal and protect the marble to give it the best chance of survival, I have no problem buying one. I guess that is what I have to learn about next--how to protect this floor as best I can and keep it looking good as long as it can.

Thanks again!
Acually, I was being a little sarcastic. Some marble etches more than others, but it's all fairly soft. I have a Makita 7" variable speed grinder that works well for polishing small areas like an entry. There are buffing pads, polishing paste, and etching removers that you can get. Lots of youtube videos you can watch.

It's a little time consuming, but not too difficult. That's probably all you will need. Just know that lots of chemicals, even vinegar, will etch the floor instantly. Be careful what you clean it with, and how you use it and you will be fine.
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Old 12-23-2012, 01:25 PM   #40
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Re: Porcelain Vs. Marble Tile


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Originally Posted by SMLWinds View Post
Thanks for the responses.

BlueRidgeGreen--Do you have any places where you can reliable get good marble? You are about 2.5 hours from me so if you have a reputable person I should contact for a price quote please let me know. I have only gotten a quote from Best Tile in Richmond. Also will be checking Morris Tile in Richmond as well as L&M Tile in Mechanicsville. I'm getting them to price the tile from Stone Partnership, Inc in NJ. They are higher end for price but but all accounts seem more selective with their process. Unfortunately, I am not sure I am qualified to really tell the difference in grades of marble and figure out whether or not a few extra bucks is worth the upgrade. I'm sure I could see the difference between the worst and the best, but in the middle would probably be tough so I'll take all the help I can get.

skcolo--Thank you for your input. Yes, I might regret this. But, I haven't found porcelain that we love and we do love this SPI bianco carrara so I'd rather risk having to replace it down the road.

Are one of those floor buffers necessary/beneficial? If that is the best way to seal and protect the marble to give it the best chance of survival, I have no problem buying one. I guess that is what I have to learn about next--how to protect this floor as best I can and keep it looking good as long as it can.

Thanks again!

Unfortunately, this place is a vast, unforgiving desert when it comes to materials acquisition. I had a couple great ones back in NYC, but this part of Va has been tough.

I met a guy in Charlottesville a little while back who seemed like a real ace. He owns a place called Sarisand Tile, his name is Pete (i think). From what I remember he has a place in the Outer Banks too.
I have never done business with him, but I got a great first impression from him the day we met. His showroom was top-notch and I saw a bunch of pics of his tile and designs. Real nice.

As I'm typing, I'm wondering why I never got back in touch with Pete............I'm going to email him now.

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