Help Me On A Sound / TV System

CNC

Im helping a friend out with some TV and sound stuff at his store. Its just a retail bicycle store, and i put up 6 JBL speakers, hooked to a harmon Kardon 2 CH. stereo receiver, sounds great. This is what i need advice on, there is a 52 inch samsung, that will be hooked to a DVD player, and digital cable box, both HDMI. The store will have music going off the ipod 95% of the time, being project over the sPeakers, and the tv on mute just playing cool videos. BUT sometimes they might want to switch the sound, too the main stereo to play the audio from the tv, and not music. I figure i will pull an HDMI to the TV, and a pair of audio RCA from the tv to the stereo and use an audio input the can select on the receiver when the want to switch from ipod, to TV sound. I wanted to hook everything to the tuner, (cable box, IPOD, and DVD) but the Tuner isnt a home theatre tuner, no hdmi.

Now if i bought a tuner that was a home theatre that could swtich hdmi inputs itself, could i have everything go through the tuner, have ONE HDMI go to the tv from the tuner, and have the ipod going over the main speakers, the tv on mute, and be able to switch from IPOD audio, to TV audio, quickly? OR do i keep the tuner he bought, get a HDMI swticher, that the DVD and cable box hook too, and one HDMI from that, then have the audio from the TV also output to the tuners input, and be able to select it to go through the tuner, over the speakers when needed.

I guess i can get multiple hdmi cables, and bring 2 hdmi cables (one DVD, one cable box) to the TV, and use an audio output to the tuner, are HDMI switchers easier? or just run two cables? the tv is like 12-15 feet away, how would you guys design a system like this? i just like the thought of one HDMI cables, and the future expansion of componets, without having to pull new cables, how do the HDMI switchers recognize what componet you want to use. Im new to this home theatre stuff, sorry. thank in advance

firemike

Can't you run RCA cables from the audio output of the TV to the receiver and get your sound? With the TV it doesn't matter what is supplying the signal to the TV (DVD, Tuner, etc.) all you want is the audio is piped over the sound system, right? If they want the iPod music all they do is select the iPod input on the receiver for the music.

__________________
-Mike-

tgeb

I would agree with running RCA cables from the TV to the Stereo.

I am not familiar with the HK stereo, does it have switchable inputs? It should, they are typically better units.

One thing I would be concerned about is running 3 pairs of speakers on the stereo. Have you installed a multi speaker switch? Does the HK have multiple speaker outputs?

A single output on the stereo (1 left, 1 right) is designed to power 1 pair of speakers. To add speakers in series changes the impedance and can damage the amplifier.

You may need to add a speaker switch that has impedance correcting capabilities.

The HK user manual should guide you on speaker set up, and what it's capabilities are. If you do't have it, see if it's on line.

Or they can buy a home theater receiver, and you can run the JBL's on the "front", "side" and "rear" of the surround channels and choose all channel stereo while playing music.

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Tom

www.gebcon.com

GregS

I think you are adding an extra path for audio in there..

Use the stereo for audio switching. So plug audio only into the different inputs on the stereo.

Use the TV for video switching. Plug video only into the TV. You can use HDMI, component, whatever. Just with HDMI you may get audio as well.

Select the inputs on each device to reflect what you want to hear/see.


And I agree about the speakers.. You cannot just tie them all together to the same outputs. You will need to balance the impedence somewhere along the line.

CNC

ok, so i will just run 2 hdmi cables up the wall for 2 devices, and if they want to add a componet, they will have to add a HDMI cable, or componet. The stereo does NOT have video switching.
For the speaker outputs, it has zone 1 right and left ( 2 speakers) and zone 2 (right and left) and you can have both zones on at once, i have zone one with 4 speakers on it, and zone 2 with two speakers on it, how do i balance the load? I need another piece of equipment, can this hurt the amplifier quickly? Thanks guys! Where do you suggest learning more about home theatre stuff?

GregS

You can use a speaker selector with impedence matching. Should be available at any big box electronics store.

As for learning.. Read, experiment, make mistakes, correct them. Just try not to make mistakes on clients equipment.

JonM

Tell the guy he needs to get anti up enough cash to get a new receiver..

I don't get it. I don't get this mentality where people will spend over a thousand dollars for a TV but nothing on sound. Are you deaf? Is sound not a consideration?

Your idea is like buying a Ferrari and tying rags on the wheels instead of tires and a dish cloth instead of wiper blades. Yeah it sorta works I guess, but what's the point? You wouldn't buy a mansion with no roof would you? Get a normal house with a roof, that's my advice.



http://www.avsforum.com/

tgeb

Golly JonM, the guy is putting a little music in a bicycle store, with a TV that most of the time will have the sound off.

It's not like he is doing an in home theater or something.

The avs forum is a good source though.

__________________
Tom

www.gebcon.com

JonM

Then why the interest in hooking it all up correctly?...If the sound isn't important...hook up a couple Walmart speakers and let it rip...I guess I am a bit of an audiophile and think poor or mediocrity in sound isn't acceptable.

CNC

I'm trying to figure out why it's mediocre sound? There 6 very nice jbl speakers, and a nice HK tuner, but there's just not enough speaker outputs? What would be the proper setup? What would a speaker selector do? Any examples

WarriorWithWood

CNC,
Something like this will work for you.
http://cgi.ebay.com/4pair-Speaker-Se...3%3A1|294%3A50

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-Dennis
www.bowmanch.com

GregS

Most speakers are rated at 8ohms.

Most stereos will amp to an 8ohm load.

Stuff two speakers into the same pair of terminals and you change it to a 4ohm load. This causes the amp to work a lot harder, especially at high volumes and overload. The amp can either jump into a protection mode, or die all together.

Use an impedance matching speaker selector suitable to drive all the speakers at once. It will allow you to add a number of 8ohm speakers to the amp and still maintain an 8ohm load so you are less likely to overload the amp.

I use Russound speaker selectors. Take a look at the manual and it may give you some proper wiring ideas.
http://www.russound.com/ss4.2.htm

CNC

i think im going to have him buy a new HK tuner, with 6 channels, so i have somewhere to hookup the speakers, and also with HDMI swtiching built in, to kill 2 birds with one stone. i understand the Impedance balancing, with a little research i found some good sites. Let me know if there is any problem with getting just a 6.1 receiver and using that, then it will be balanced....right?

GregS

No, then it will be surround sound.

There may be an audio mode on there to do 6-channel stereo, but you will have to verify that.

A speaker selector will cost a lot less.

CNC

hmm the only thing is there is multiple componets to hook up, and i was trying to solve the problem with having to run multiple cables to the tv, and use just one HDMI, if i got one with HMDI switching built in. And also solve the issue with the speakers. I would think it would have a normal stereo listening mode...

tgeb

I can't say for the HK but my Onkyo surround sound receiver does have an all channel stereo setting.

__________________
Tom

www.gebcon.com

GregS

You are just making it more confusing.

Get a speaker selector and plug all your speakers into that.

Run an HDMI cable from the DVD player to the TV.

Run an HDMI cable from the cable box to the TV.

Run a stereo RCA pair from the DVD player to the receiver.

Run a stereo RCA pair from the cable box to the TV.

If you want to watch something, change the input on the TV.

If you want to hear something, change the input on the receiver.


If the DVD player and cable box carry audio in their HDMI (not all do) then you will be able to hear them on the TV.. but that just may be annoying with the receiver playing something different in the same space.

CNC

I got a speakers switcher. A 25' hdmi for cable box to tv, and another for DVD. I also got A 25' RCA audio cable from Tv audio output, to receiver. When iPod is on, select aux on receiver. Plays on all speakers. When I want the tv to play I press Tv on receiver because I'll plug the RCA from tv audio output to , tv audio input on receiver. DOne, all hdmi cables don't carry audio?

GregS

It's not up to the cable. It's up to the devices on either end of the cable.

CNC

Very good to know, how do they label this on the specs? (audio in the hdmi) know the DVD player does it, now it's just if the cable box does!