Invisible Deck Fasteners - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

y0manda · 07-15-2007, 11:10 AM

Building a small deck for a newer trailer park model two sets of stairs and a walkway about 48"x35'. Using trex, The homeowner asked me if I am going to be using the invisible deck fasteners for the first time after all the framing for the deck is completed. I have never used these before and not sure what hardware store carries them, but my question is How much more time is involved with this method/how much more should I charge? and what brand of fasteners should I go with?. Do they sale them @ HD or Lowes or Ganahl Lumber? Thanks

RobertCDF · 07-15-2007, 11:30 AM

It depends upon what you use but I would say double-triple the time to lay the decking.

dvon104 · 07-15-2007, 11:32 AM

use the ..EB-TY fastner...I sell alot of IPE 5/4x6 decking...and the installers love this Eb-Ty system...but its not cheap ...but neither is Trex

**BuiltByMAC** · 07-15-2007, 03:37 PM

You've got two basic hidden fastener systems - ones that work with grooved boards and ones that work with non-grooved boards.

TREX does not have grooved boards (last I checked) so Eb-Ty and similar systems are out. (As an aside, I just used Eb-Ty fasteners on 5/4 Ipe and absolutely hate them. They are a flimsy plastic disc that the finish screw head pulls through if you screw it in just a hair too deep. If they are that flimsy that the head pulls through just screwing down the fastener, how fast are those IPE boards going to pull the Eb-Ty clip up when the boards move?)

HFS (hidden fastener systems) that work with non-grooved boards are Grabber DeckMaster, FastenMaster IQ, Tiger Claw, Shadoe Track, etc. Of those, I've used the Grabber Deckmaster on an elevated TREX deck. It gives a good, positive hold for the boards but there will be a learning curve for you to become familiar with it.

It does take more time to install and is more expensive than top down screwing. Maybe I'm making a poor assumption here, but a 4' walkway for a doublewide might not be the best place to sell upgrades.

If you want to purchase them, you can buy them online (search for the terms above) or ask your contact at your local lumberyard if they can get them. HD and Lowes are not the first places I go to purchase materials.

Mac

dvon104 · 07-15-2007, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuiltByMAC

You've got two basic hidden fastener systems - ones that work with grooved boards and ones that work with non-grooved boards.

TREX does not have grooved boards (last I checked) so Eb-Ty and similar systems are out. (As an aside, I just used Eb-Ty fasteners on 5/4 Ipe and absolutely hate them. They are a flimsy plastic disc that the finish screw head pulls through if you screw it in just a hair too deep. If they are that flimsy that the head pulls through just screwing down the fastener, how fast are those IPE boards going to pull the Eb-Ty clip up when the boards move?)

HFS (hidden fastener systems) that work with non-grooved boards are Grabber DeckMaster, FastenMaster IQ, Tiger Claw, Shadoe Track, etc. Of those, I've used the Grabber Deckmaster on an elevated TREX deck. It gives a good, positive hold for the boards but there will be a learning curve for you to become familiar with it.

It does take more time to install and is more expensive than top down screwing. Maybe I'm making a poor assumption here, but a 4' walkway for a doublewide might not be the best place to sell upgrades.

If you want to purchase them, you can buy them online (search for the terms above) or ask your contact at your local lumberyard if they can get them. HD and Lowes are not the first places I go to purchase materials.

Mac

well....The installers here ask for them by name...I do not even stock them...I have to special order them...maybe that might be because that is all has ever been used in this market..or EB-TY spent marketing $$ here ..I do not know...but thanks for the names of those others ...I will call my vendor's and see if they are available here...

I am always looking for new products ..that maybe my competiton is not selling....

dougchips · 07-15-2007, 03:53 PM

Stay away from the tiger claws or at least save your receipt. Check put the new hidden fasteners that Elk sells, they have little teeth in them to control movement.

JustaFramer · 07-15-2007, 04:04 PM

Ok I did this once with trex. use trapeze head screw that take the #1 square head bit. Drive them just below the flush and take the material the screwing produces and put it over the head and hit it was a smooth faced hammer. The only problem with that is when the rain hits it and the sun come out those parts with rise a little the first time. Give them a smack again and they should lay flat forever.

I am not sure if this voids the warrenty. I asked for some info on trex at the lumber store and they gave me the sale info. dildos. If it doesn't it worked great for me. Still looked good after 2 years after I did it.

y0manda · 07-15-2007, 07:32 PM

Never really gave it much thought on which fasteners would work but, the color/style Trex deck this homeowner wants has the grooves on the underneath of the boards will fasteners still work? I really just want to chalk some lines and top screw it.

dougchips · 07-15-2007, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by y0manda

Never really gave it much thought on which fasteners would work but, the color/style Trex deck this homeowner wants has the grooves on the underneath of the boards will fasteners still work? I really just want to chalk some lines and top screw it.

Use a pre-grooved decking. Have the Home owner cough up so dough for good decking.

RobertCDF · 07-15-2007, 08:17 PM

Well I was not going to go into telling the homeowner that he made a piss poor choice of decking... But since someone else already sugested it I will recomend buying a differant material Correct Deck CX (wow what a suprise... ) It has the clips and it looks 10X better than trex now and in 10 years. It is much more stain, scratch, fade resistant than trex dreams about.

y0manda · 07-16-2007, 12:02 AM

RobertCDF Whats the price difference of Correct Deck CX compared to Trex? thanks.

RobertCDF · 07-16-2007, 06:15 PM

dunno.... I dont use trex. I buy cx for 2.88 lf

y0manda · 07-18-2007, 08:59 PM

Well thanks for the opinions the homeowner still wanted to go with trex and not pay any more for the hidden fasteners. (funny they always want the free sh*t but when I give them a price they change their mind) The deck is turning out great and thanks for the tip on hitting the material back over the deck screws it looks almost invisible. I'll post some pictures tomorrow.

JustaFramer · 07-18-2007, 09:56 PM

The product used when I reskinned the deck was the origins madiera color. The mash over technique was almost invisible. With trex other lines I don't now how it would look.

y0manda · 07-23-2007, 07:32 PM

Need to buy two more post sleeves then im just about finished
I don't have enough posts to do URL's so copy and paste this

Http://y0manda.serveftp.net:81/gallery/Distabile

wink · 07-28-2007, 05:55 PM

i used the eb-ty fasetners once, used my plate jointer to cut slots for them, they still sucked!!!! of course that is just my opinion

griesbaum · 07-31-2007, 10:27 PM

Trex and other manufacturers are now selling groved planks. Worth the extra expense. You simply use biscuit shaped fasteners.

Let the home owner know if they ever need to replace a deck board, this becomes a costly change for them. Also, cost to install, consider 30% more since it is time consuming to secure and place next plank vrs. securing from above.

RobertCDF · 08-01-2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by griesbaum

Trex and other manufacturers are now selling groved planks. Worth the extra expense. You simply use biscuit shaped fasteners.

Let the home owner know if they ever need to replace a deck board, this becomes a costly change for them. Also, cost to install, consider 30% more since it is time consuming to secure and place next plank vrs. securing from above.

hmm.... Must suck to use a crappy biscuit system then. Correct Deck with the HFS installs about 20% FASTER than face screwing... And it looks nicer and can be sold as an upgrade.

Il Fissatore · 08-17-2007, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by griesbaum

Trex and other manufacturers are now selling groved planks. Worth the extra expense. You simply use biscuit shaped fasteners.

Let the home owner know if they ever need to replace a deck board, this becomes a costly change for them. Also, cost to install, consider 30% more since it is time consuming to secure and place next plank vrs. securing from above.

The G clip from Tiger Claw is actually a pretty easy fix for a bad board... slides right on once the old board is removed with two simple cuts...

Thewoodman · 08-22-2007, 11:35 PM

Yomanda

You said something about chalking a line on the trex deck. The chalk lines do not like to come of to well, be carefull.

Mark