How Do You Bid The Larger, Creative Projects?

BreyerConstruct

Here's a question for you fellow builders:

I know my costs pretty well when I look at a basic deck. Heck, even if it's a larger project, but can be broken down into smaller pieces, I'm pretty comfortable.

Attached is a deck design for a prospect. It's not fully "fleshed out" yet, but it gives a pretty good idea of what we've discussed. I'm now starting to work thru the details of the price, and while I'm willing to take the time to think each stage and section thru, and work up the numbers, I thought it might be wise to ask of y'all here, to see if you had any thoughts on how to think projects thru that don't fit as well into boxes. - to explain better, I'm kinda thinking about working up what I think it should cost, but weighing more heavily on "what's it worth", in terms of custom product developed to meet the customer's needs.

Any thoughts? I've got fairly thick skin, so feel free to be honest.
Thanks,
~Matt

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BreyerConstruct

A quick PS: That's an 80' x 4' walkway on the left side (HO is expecting surgery & reduced mobility soon).

Total Sq. Ft. of the deck is just under 2000.

The octagon is for a custom Pergola.

~Matt

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RYANINMICHIGAN

I would break it down into stages. Basiclly I see 4 projects. Because I work alone. I would have to build it that way. I diveded it how I woudl quote it. Scrtach that i don't know how to add pics. #1 main deck #2 next deck stepping down #4 ramp from he!! #5 pergola deck and walkway.

RYANINMICHIGAN

also looking at this. If they are in a chair, woudln't they want a ramp down to the second deck to access teh Pregola?

BreyerConstruct

Good thought about the ramp!

They're thinking on the ramp needs is that they might only need the ramp for temporary use; we could create a small matching/ removable ramp section to fit over the steps if needed, then remove it once the HO is back to ability...

I'll add it to my notes to talk thru with them.

Thank you!!!
~Matt

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RobertCDF

Sounds like a LOT of money for a temp ramp... I know it can be used still but who wants to walk 80' if they dont have to when a few steps would do.

I like the project and like mickey said I would break it into 3-5 differant sections.

BTW what are you using for design software? Is that sketchup or decktools?

If they have a walkout basement I would want to use larger beams so you have less posts.

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Robert Shaw
Colorado Springs Custom Decks
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BreyerConstruct

Not really a walk-out, but I'll clean up the underside & framing detail if/when I know I've got the project.

The 80' ramp will always stay, as it will be an asset for entertaining (getting guests around to the back of the property), as well as for the HO as the get older. I was talking about a temp. ramp to go over the 2 steps between the deck levels, so there's access to the Gazebo.

Yup, it's DeckTools.

Thanks for input guys!
~Matt

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lgoode

That is an impressive job. How long will you be on site? Are you bidding against anyone? I'm glad you think of it like bidding a custom home or something like that; to me that's appropriate for the high level specialty work.

An underdeck drainage system, especially if it's a walkout basement as Robert suggests, might be a possible option to include if you haven't already.
Marty

RobertCDF

Toss some accent colors in with a border??? Maybe some breaker boards in the accent color to give it some sparkle.

How long did that take with deck tools?
Do you like decktools?

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Colorado Springs Custom Decks
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Teetorbilt

Tough call without dimensions and elevations. Here, I'd guesstimate somewhere around $140-250K.

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BreyerConstruct

Marty,

I've got it figured for us to be on site for 3-4 weeks.
That's running a crew of 2-6 guys, depending on the particular part of the project, and my labor availability (it's supposed to be built after a few guys go back to school).

Trex referred them to us, and they like the Contours line or products...
I personally think it'd be a heck of a project to use CorrectDeck or Moisture Shield on. If they like the initial proposal & are willing to move further, then we'll be talking about lighting, skirting/ lattice, and possible decking upgrades.

Speaking of which, Robert: I like the idea of mixing in a few accent ideas. The struggle there is that the Contours line is only 2 colors, and I'm not sure if they want to go that direction... I'd like to see another product used, and tweaking the decking design at that point would be a perfect way to bring it all together.

As for DT, it's an awesome program.
I spent just over 2 hours on site with the homeowners when we first met, and created a quick rough sketch with some basic measurements. The drawing on DT probably took me an hour total. I didn't do it all in one sitting, as sometimes I get restless trying to get a design tweaked & need to put it down & try again later.

DT is great for giving a visual overview, and creating a basic framing/building plan.
There are still several features, enhancements, and improvements that are slated to be released, but have been stuck in final development. When it's finally upgraded, it should be stunning.

Teetor, thanks for chiming in!
This is about 70' long at the longest point, and the main deck area is about 20' x 16'. The deck is about 9' above grade, except for the boardwalk portion, which is at-grade.

I haven't nailed down an exact price yet; my range as-is w/o any upgrades is 60k - 70k.
But... that's where I start to question myself. I mean, I think I can do it for about 55k, if I've got everything figured out correctly. But, a project this big & cool on a one-in-a-million house looking at the same value of a view... for folks selling another house to make improvements here... 100k??

I have no wish to be greedy, or to take advantage of anyone. On the same token, I don't want to under-value our services or abilities either.

Any further thoughts?
Thanks guys!
~Matt

PS. Rendered view from inside the house attached...

Attached Thumbnails

 

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One other quick note, as I'm not sure if I mentioned it B4:
Anywhere you don't see balusters is slated to get tempered glass.
I have the deck stepping down to help get the required railing out of the way, and the glass should also assist with that.

~Matt

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Flikka

Is that rendered view true to what they really see outside their windows? Awesome.

I think that you should always charge for your talent as a designer as well as what you would charge as the builder. Charge as you would to build and then find out how much it would have cost to have a hardscape architect/designer design the deck then charge for it accordingly. That charge, in my mind should be billed to them before any other contracts or money changes hands, certainly before you give them a copy of the design. I'd hate for you to hand over the design thinking you had the job and then for them to take it and shop it out elsewhere.

Good for them to be thinking about aging and all the wonderful things it brings. Building not only to be able to stay in their home but live in it to the fullest as well is the only way to go these days.

Good Luck
Mary

BreyerConstruct

Hey Mary,

Thanks for the thoughts on the build price + the design price, that helped a lot.

As for the rendered view, it's accurate to the drawing, and its fairly close to what it should look like once built.

Chat later,
~Matt

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woodmagman

For a grand or two you can buy a lift....then sell it when not needed...not such a big cost when the smoke clears.