Hidden Fasteners

MartyCD

Man, in 4" CorrectDeck CX in the color merlot... and I can't believe Selectwood didn't push that more, we have done a lot for those guys. (I'll send samples, just say the word).

I am a fan of the Headcotes, they use 305 stainless, we have seen it hold up well (we use Headcotes for the Fastenators). Together with the Smartbit, it makes it easy to deliver a great look.

Remind the client that ipe takes some regular (probably annual) upkeep to keep the initial beautiful rich brown that will match their home, and see if you can get the contract to do that too...

Will there be railings on this job?

redwood

With the plugging, it depends on whether you want to notice the plugs or hide the fastners.

I've noticed that I have been getting more varied colors of ipe and if you are trying to hide the plugs, they need to be the same tint as the rest of the board.

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Mark
Los Gatos, CA
www.creative-redwood-designs.com

Greg Di

I had an initial issue with some mild squeaking, but it went away quickly after the deck got used to itself.

My original thread was #3 on google for a while, but it's old now.

I PM'd you the thread link.

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Jaketoo

My feeling with the plugs, is it would be good to see them, but they should not stand out to much. For example at Selectwood on display they had Golden Grappa decking with ipe plugs. It looked pretty good, but on a full size deck it would be way to busy. The plugs really stick out.
When you look at the deck I don't want the plugs to jump out. I don't want a polka dot deck. On the other hand, when people are hanging out on the deck, I want them to appreciate all the hard work. I want the homeowner to tell everyone what a fine craftsman and perfectionist his contractor is. I want him to point out that I plugged every fastener.
The deck will have the Woodway railing system in cedar. The homeowner wanted the decking to match the rail, but I told him I thought the contrast between the two woods may make the deck more interesting (theres no way to make ipe match cedar anyway). It ads more detail. The whole house has many different kinds of flooring, and interior trim. The house is very interesting. They did things like installing dinged up doors from the 1800's. I think that's one of the things that makes this house stand out. It's all about the interesting details.
I kinda miss the days where I could just run down to the lumber yard, load up some stock, and build something. There are so many things to think about these days. I have already spent many hours planning this job. I hope I'm not underestimating the labor involved with plugging.

redwood

I don't think that you can overestimate the plugging. How big is the deck anyway? Sanding is the difficult part. Ipe is so darn hard, if your plugs require a lot of sanding, you might be there for days.

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Mark
Los Gatos, CA
www.creative-redwood-designs.com

Splinter

Plugging does add some serious time to the project. A handful of sharp drill bits are a must.. A dull bit leaves a ratty looking hole that will really stand out. I also want to mention again what's already been said.. You need to drill the hole a hair undersized, and make your plugs from several different shades of scrap so you can really color match each plug to the board it's going in.

One more thing.. If you're doing 12 oc, you really only have to fasten the boards every other joist. A bazillion plugs every 12" would really look busy.

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- Alex

Long Island Remodeling Contractor

Aframe

I used the Deckmaster on a composite deck and it worked well. As noted the hardness of IPE will be an issue.

Was able to screw the boards from above while kneeling on them to hold in place. It was actually easier than fastening from below as you didn't push the board out of place while setting the screw.

Used Ebtys on a recent ramp/porch. A lot of prep before you could set the decking and we had to place the next piece onto the tie/biscuit before setting the screw, or it would bend the biscuit down and you could not get the next board under the clips. This was for 4' boards so I can't imaging what it would of been like for 12-16' pieces.

Once we got the system down it went ok, especiall where you can't get under the deck, but I ended up using the left over deckmaster pieces for the porch platform.

Jaketoo

The deck is 18x18.
What do you sand the decking with? Do you hand sand? Any special grit?
I was going to buy Tapered ipe plugs, but I will consider cutting my own if they don't match.
I found some pictures of plugged ipe on the internet. It looks MUCH better when the plugs blend well with the decking.
Sharp drill bits is good advice. I have been concerned about ratty looking holes. As far as bit size, there is a countersink bit designed to be used with plugs (I think). They had some kind of kit at the decking supplier. I will have to make sure it is a little smaller then plugs.
I thought I would go back to 16" o.c. VS. 12". I was originally going to do 1x4 (now 5/4x4) that's why I was going to do 12".
I am going to pre-stain decking on the horses with penetrating oil. I know a guy who used a urethane based sealer that lifted, and the deck is full of ugly black streaks after one year. I wonder if I should skip the face up side, and wait till I plug and sand. I was planning to pre-stain all sides and sand face after plugging, then recoat, but it might be a hassle to sand stained lumber. It might gum up the paper.
Should ipe be sanded before putting penetrating oil on? Is it important to get rid of any sheen?

Jaketoo

Aframe I just saw your post. I have spent many hours researching HFS and Deckmaster is the only one I have found no negative comments about. If I was not going to plug and screw I would probably try Deckmaster.

jimbobjoe

Do any of you guys have experience with a straight hidden fastener system (unlike the deckmaster shape) like this:

rona.ca/shop/~deck-track-produits-pylex-248017_produits-pylex_metal-studs_building-materials-accessories_shop

basically nails to the joist from the top and has a bit of a bend to provide some resistance when screwing the deck boards down. I have not tried a hidden fastener system before and thought I might give this a whirl this time.

deckspec

I absoutley agree that Ipe cannot be properly fastened via hidden fasteners, the web is filled with horror stories of decks that are warping and pulling out of the hidden fastners, Ipe is very stable usually, exspecailly the 5/4x6 or the 1x4 but in low deck with poor venitlation and high moisture content under the deck even 1x4 and 5/4x6 boards can cup, simple physics the bootom of the board absorbs moisture and gets bigger the top does dries out in the sun and gets smaller. Ipe is soo strong that when it does try and cup it cannot be contained by anything other then a quailty through-screw.

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paul
http://www.deckspecialists.com/

Bone Saw

welcome to the site paul, love your website, looking forward to your input here

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Ahren

Hey Paul! I know you. We met a couple of years ago.

BTW, your post is 100% right.

Ipe + hidden fasteners = no-no.

PA woodbutcher

I'll second that! Beautiful work

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