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Old 11-05-2009, 09:45 PM   #1
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rewiring first floor.

Hello
I am rewiring my first floor. It is actually an over/under duplex. we plan on turning it into a single family home one day.
this is what I have so far; I was wondering if everything sounds OK.

KITCHEN
small appliance --------two 20 amp (all gf )
fridge ----------------one 20 amp
garbage disposal and hood vent -one 20 amp
stove ----8/3 ----------40 amp
dishwasher------------one-20 amp

DIN ROOM AND BREAKFAST ROOM ( wired together but separate rooms)
rec --one 20 amp

2 BED ROOMS
each room on it own 20 amp arc fault including light. and fire alarm

BATH ROOM
one - 20 amp serving one bathroom and one powder room ( two receptacle total (gf) no lighting)

Laundry Room
Dryer-- 10/3--30amp
washer + one more receptacle in that room - one- 20 amp
water heater 10/2 ---30 amp

Lighting is figured on 1500 sq ( just on that floor) = 4500
I also did an estimated watts on lighting ( we do not have the lighting but we will be putting 10 , 12 , 15 bulb lights. I figured 4300 watts (NOT including the bedrooms.)

Lighting-- three--15 amp

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Old 11-05-2009, 09:50 PM   #2
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What electrical code are you under?
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:13 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by 480sparky View Post
What electrical code are you under?
I always wire N/C smoke detectors on one circuit which makes the interconnect a breeze.

Yeah, where are you?
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:14 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music9704 View Post
Hello
I am rewiring my first floor. It is actually an over/under duplex. we plan on turning it into a single family home one day.
this is what I have so far; I was wondering if everything sounds OK.

KITCHEN
small appliance --------two 20 amp (all gf )
fridge ----------------one 20 amp
garbage disposal and hood vent -one 20 amp
stove ----8/3 ----------40 amp
dishwasher------------one-20 amp

DIN ROOM AND BREAKFAST ROOM ( wired together but separate rooms)
rec --one 20 amp

2 BED ROOMS
each room on it own 20 amp arc fault including light. and fire alarm

BATH ROOM
one - 20 amp serving one bathroom and one powder room ( two receptacle total (gf) no lighting)

Laundry Room
Dryer-- 10/3--30amp
washer + one more receptacle in that room - one- 20 amp
water heater 10/2 ---30 amp

Lighting is figured on 1500 sq ( just on that floor) = 4500
I also did an estimated watts on lighting ( we do not have the lighting but we will be putting 10 , 12 , 15 bulb lights. I figured 4300 watts (NOT including the bedrooms.)

Lighting-- three--15 amp
Just noticed that.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:39 PM   #5
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Yes I live in Portsmouth Virginia
this is my own home.
thought if smoke D were in the bedroom they had to be arc fault.
I could put the SD out side the bedrooom.

Last edited by music9704; 11-05-2009 at 10:42 PM.
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music9704 View Post
Hello
I am rewiring my first floor. It is actually an over/under duplex. we plan on turning it into a single family home one day.
this is what I have so far; I was wondering if everything sounds OK.

Red is what I would do differently, Blue is what you said that I would change. We have some local codes that change things. We are required to run #12 wire even on 15A lighting circuits so I would just do the lighting circuits as 20A.

KITCHEN
small appliance --------two 20 amp (all gf )
fridge ----------------one 20 amp
garbage disposal and hood vent -one 20 amp
garbage disposal and dishwasher - one 20A
stove ----8/3 ----------40 amp
Range 6/3 w/g 60A
dishwasher------------one-20 amp

over range m/w/hood -one 20A

DIN ROOM AND BREAKFAST ROOM ( wired together but separate rooms)
rec --one 20 amp, max 4 receptacles per circuit

2 BED ROOMS
each room on it own 20 amp arc fault including light. and fire alarm
Separate circuit for smoke detectors

BATH ROOM
one - 20 amp serving one bathroom and one powder room ( two receptacle total (gf) no lighting)

Laundry Room
Dryer-- 10/3--30amp
washer + one more receptacle in that room - one- 20 amp
Washer 1@20A
Convenience Recept 1@20A GFCI
water heater 10/2 ---30 amp
Use gas

Lighting is figured on 1500 sq ( just on that floor) = 4500
I also did an estimated watts on lighting ( we do not have the lighting but we will be putting 10 , 12 , 15 bulb lights. I figured 4300 watts (NOT including the bedrooms.)

Lighting-- three--15 amp
Lighting is a big variable. Ceiling Fans? Exterior Lights? Recessed lights in K?
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:07 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music9704 View Post
...........thought if smoke D were in the bedroom they had to be arc fault.
I could put the SD out side the bedrooom.
That may not make a difference. What electrical code are you under?
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:17 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music9704 View Post
Yes I live in Portsmouth Virginia
this is my own home.
thought if smoke D were in the bedroom they had to be arc fault.
I could put the SD out side the bedrooom.
Depends on your local AHJ and their amendments to the NEC.

I will be frank, you seem to have a good basic grasp of the NEC and the very basic elements, but your post history indicates that you are doing more than rewiring your first floor. I don't doubt you have a contractors license, but in some states all you need to prove is that you don't have a criminal history and can prove a certain level of net worth.

I really am not trying to bust your chops here. Not in any way. However my gut feeling from reading your previous posts is that you are relying on advice you find here to help you with electrical work that you might not yet be prepared to take on yourself. (Part of my view on this is derived from the fact that you are asking for help on your own home)

Just a suggestion, check out the sister site (DIY). Alot of the same electrical contractors that are posters here (including myself) are more than willing to help you out there with more detailed instructions and advice (but perhaps under different identities).

Please don't take offense at this post. I'm just being honest. If your area of expertise is simply not electric, then feel free to jump in when you can help in other areas. (as long as you are truly a contractor)

It's a rough bunch of guys here sometimes, but they are pretty darned human once you get a few more posts under your belt.

Ron
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Old 11-06-2009, 09:46 AM   #9
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rselectric

but your post history indicates that you are doing more than rewiring your first floor.
I bought a duplex. I started finishing the unfinished kitchen because the prior owner tried to remodel the first floor. This "electrician", simply ran wires through the outside of walls each room. He then hung the drywall and went back and cut in old work boxes. While working on the kitchen I found a wire in bedroom/kitchen wall that he had not put in a box. HUM He also had 10/3 for stove wire and alot of other crazy stuff. Now I am rewiring the first floor. I can't pay an electrican to try to trace this guys footsteps. Belive me I don't like going behind other people fixing their mistakes, beside the fact the craw is only a foot tall.


I don't doubt you have a contractors license, but in some states all you need to prove is that you don't have a criminal history and can prove a certain level of net worth.

Not quite sure how to take this at all ...
1 are you saying I am stupid?
2 are you saying all contractors are stupid?
3 are you asking if I had to take some type of ele test?
NO I did not. Are contractors supposed to know how to wire a house?
are contractors supposed to know hvac, plumbing?
If this were a job, I would hire an electrician.
I AM NOT AN ELECTRICAN. I AM NOT AN ELECTRICAL CONTRACTOR.
I AM NOT A PLUMBING CONTRACTOR.
I am a GENERAL CONTRACTOR.
I quit contracting for a while, then moved, so in turn I have lost a lot of my contacts; otherwise I would not even be here asking these questions.
now should I explain why I quit?????? Why I bought a house in such bad shape???? If you don't want to answer the question, then don't.


Just a suggestion, check out the sister site (DIY).
Please don't take offense at this post. I'm just being honest

I think I will because, and I'm "JUST BEING HONEST" here, most of the people on this forum think they are gods.
I was sure I would get "DID YOU PULL A PERMIT.......", as an answer somewhere.

Again, If you don't want to answer the question, don't.

Last edited by music9704; 11-06-2009 at 09:53 AM.
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Old 11-06-2009, 08:40 PM   #10
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I am an electrical God and I say to wire your smoke detector's to a lighting circuit. Since I am an electrical God, may I also suggest using Kiddie/ Firex brand and follow the manufacturers suggestions on placement. Another electrical God taught me that several years ago, it was a blessing of sorts.
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Old 11-06-2009, 09:33 PM   #11
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Music,
You misread my intentions. My post was meant to gently steer you to the DIY site for the questions you posed. I don't know how I could have been more tactful.

When I read your reply, it bugged me that I may have come across the wrong way. I was going to let this post just go away, and assumed we would meet again on other threads.

I also wanted to spare you the frustration of dealing with some of the inevitable barbs you would have encountered being a new poster on the site with questions that sound exactly like ones a homeowner would pose if he got through the "front door" undetected. Once you are around here awhile you will see exactly what I mean. GUARANTEED.

I have absolutely no doubt now you are a legitimate contractor, but by your own admissions, you are not an electrician. As you know, true GC's (who are referred to sometimes around here are "paper contractors") are not expected to know the details of every trade. But you are contemplating biting off a task that if done incorrectly, can cause people to get hurt. (Like your family for instance)

In this post, you ignored a simple question posed by 480 Sparky who has more electrical knowlege than I could ever hope to attain, and he asked again, and you didn't respond to his question which could have laid the groundwork for which code you fall under as well as the local amendments.

Your electrical plan seems to summarily pass my approval but I don't know all the details either, so I would defer to a licensed electrician who has had the opportunity to physically look at what else this previous owner may have screwed up.

I hope your reaction to my well intentioned post has not soured you on this website. It's a terrific site to ask questions, help fellow contractors who are experiencing something you have been through and have figured out out to handle, and to just blow off some steam with like minded guys.

I hope there are no hard feelings, and I look forward to seeing you around here.
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Old 11-07-2009, 10:44 PM   #12
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You could put the smoke alarm outside the bedroom but that would not meet the code requirements. Smoke alarms are required inside all bedrooms and immediately outside the bedrooms. This is not a requirement of the electrical code but the electrical code does require that the smoke alarms that are inside bedrooms must be on arc fault circuits. These are the kind of things you should know cold before you undertake the project that you are proposing. If you truely are a GC do what GC's do and get on the phone and hire the cheapest sub that you can find to do the work. If they don't know what they are doing at least you will have someone to shoulder the liability when something goes wrong.
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Old 11-18-2009, 12:05 AM   #13
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I don't know how I could have been more tactful.
I thought you done rather well.
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