I Didn't Do It

davitk

Long time customer called me up two months ago, wanted to install a towel warmer to surprise his wife, one of those 2K gold plated dohickeys from Europe . So I figured no big deal, I can handle pulling a wire, installing six gold plated screws to hang it from the wall and flipping the switch.

So since this is a "big surprise" the HO and wife are on vacation, and of course he has no cell phone and even if, I am not allowed to contact him so as not to spoil the surprise..... I opened the panel and found this (a real electrician is coming for a look-see tomorrow):

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jarhead0531

That box is a disaster. I'd love to hear what they think caused that. What color are the third and fourth wire from the bottom on the right hand side? They look like a ground going to the break, I'm sure it isn't but sure looks like it.

Who is the manufacter of the panel?

tinner666

No biggie! Just do your hook-up hot!

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Frank Slate Roof Repairs, Richmond, Va.

tinner666

Not ground. Pinkish. Can see the writing on the insulation as they cross over the top in the close-up.

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Frank Slate Roof Repairs, Richmond, Va.

Chris Johnson

Now I know why they (use to) ask for drywall behind the panel...

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Chris

jarhead0531

Gotcha, I can see it in the closeup. I've never seen that color before, wonder how old it is.

Speedy Petey

That is a Challenger panel.

Those two wires are brown THHN.

I have seen MANY burned up mains, but this one is about as bad as I've seen.

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send_it_all

Oh lighten up...it's not that bad. Just alligator clip your new wires to those bare metal parts where all that melted plastic is.....you'll be fine.

JamesNLA

What are you all talking about? All I see is 3 grand right there. Instant mortgage payment!!

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"....And then we all switch places when I ring the bell"
-Adrock

Winchester

Are you allowed doubling up the wires like that where you live? (bottom right)

Anyway, looks like the panel is full. Don't know if you can get tandem breakers for that kind of panel and swap some out, I've never seen that type before.

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Ryan

Magnettica

No, you are not allowed to "double up" on breakers because the terminals are rated for 1 wire, not 2. Pigtailing in a panel is ok though.

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SonoranShocker

WOW Pigtail in a panel? I wouldn't even try that. Just do it right the first time (well for you anyway) and install tandems. They do make them for that panel.

Man this is why DIY can sometimes be a horrible horrible thing.

Agolk2

Just cut the photo of the warmer off the box, paste it to the wall and write "To be continued....." under it.

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Andrew Golkin
ANG Visuals
www.ANGVisuals.com
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jarhead0531

Never heard of Challenger before. I've have only seen three around these parts: SquareD, Cutler Hammer, Siemens. Now for what may be a dumb question, why the hell is there brown thhn in that panel? I know it should be marked as hots, but they aren't.

Maybe the better question to ask it, why would an electrian carry around brown thhn?? Is it used on commercial jobs??

gregj

They doubled up the wires because the breakers that use to be connected to the wires won't fit the melted carcass anymore. That's why those breakers are sitting in the bottom of the panel. The owner should have known about this problem since "someone" removed those breakers and reconnected the wires to the other breakers. I assume a real electrician wouldn't have left it that way so one might jump to the conclusion the owner did.

So you are apparently suppose to make this little problem go away while he's gone - for no additional money I'm sure.

Install the whole towel warmer except for the final electrical hookup to the panel. When he returns let him know you will hook it up when the panel is replaced and that you could have your electrician do that for $*** if he'd like.

Michael Olding

A believe a Challenger box is a HD or Lowes... seems I have seen them there in the past.

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mdshunk

You must have a good memory. I think they went by the wayside circa 1988 or so.

Challenger was bought out by Cutler-Hammer, along with some other Westinghouse lookalikes like Bryant, and are now sold as Cutler Hammer type BR. For a brief period of time, the Challenger panels said "Cutler Hammer Challenger" on them. I'd probably replace that box with a Cutler Hammer type BR panel just so that I could reuse all of the breakers in it that are still good. I see a mix-n-match of breakers in that panel, as it is. I notice a couple T&B's, and at least one Siemens. It's a Challenger panel, though.

walkerj

Hmm....I wonder

Magnettica

Whoa wait a second... I explained that pigtailing was allowed, not that I do it, or would do it here. Looks like a 200 amp upgrade to me

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mdshunk

Ya.

davitk, you're not an electrician I hope.