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06-24-2009, 02:15 PM
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#1
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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Could hot aluminum fascia run power bill up?
Bumped into a roof corner and got shocked  Turned out the neutral wire to security light was hot, hot was hot too and home owner couldnt remember when security light quick working as soffit guys and electrician were close together.
Old 20-30's house with 3 generations of electrical married together, I found the feed to the light and disconnected it, homeowner doesnt need it. Anyway I couldnt shut down the whole house and see if power was bleeding but I wonder. House is stone, didnt check to see what else on the house was hot. HO complained of high bills, wasnt a dead short or would have breaker. Puzzle was why would the switched power work while the neutral stayed hot and the breaker killed both.
What do you think, was this a power drain?
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06-24-2009, 02:41 PM
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#2
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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The "neutral" in a 2-wire 120 volt circuit is a current-carry conductor. It carries the same amount of current as the "hot" conductor. Yours seems like a classic example of what happens when someone wires a GFCI ground wire directly to a copper pipe... OR... someone instead of using a neutral at the GFCI, picked up a ground directly from a metal box and used it as a neutral. It's called OBJECTIONABLE CURRENT FLOW and now you know why it's called objectionable - because you shouldn't be getting shocked touching a fascia board.
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06-24-2009, 02:54 PM
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#3
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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No GFI's in the house, liscensed electrician had put in a new panel so HO could have new heat/air system and fed existing panel. If I were electrician I dont think I'd do jobs like that. Also fixed 3 outlets hot wrong side, lot of hacks out there.
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06-24-2009, 03:34 PM
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#4
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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GFCI or not you have objectionable current flow and it's likely caused by a bond somewhere other than in the main disconnect.
"Also fixed 3 outlets hot wrong side, lot of hacks out there."
that's where I would start looking first.
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06-24-2009, 03:45 PM
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#5
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
GFCI or not you have objectionable current flow and it's likely caused by a bond somewhere other than in the main disconnect.
"Also fixed 3 outlets hot wrong side, lot of hacks out there."
that's where I would start looking first.
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The feed for the light came off receptacle that was near light, only one wire , couldnt find where the neutral was coming from, light did work at one time. I killed the circuit, checked rest of house, end of story.
What I'm curious of is since the entire fascia and inside perimeter of soffit was hot could it have been a current drain?
HO thought it was funny when I mentioned that he could have been just plugging his christmas lights into the roof.
Last edited by willworkforbeer; 06-24-2009 at 03:49 PM.
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06-24-2009, 03:51 PM
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#6
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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Yes, what you mean by current drain I really have no idea but yes the circuit was using the aluminum fascia to return current to the source in which it came from. Now that path has been broken and that's why your light isn't working.
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06-24-2009, 04:03 PM
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#7
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
Yes, what you mean by current drain I really have no idea but yes the circuit was using the aluminum fascia to return current to the source in which it came from. Now that path has been broken and that's why your light isn't working.
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I know why my light isnt working, I killed all power to it! The homeowner is fine with it, no problems.
If you dont know what a current drain is I dont know how you could be an electrician.
′kər·ənt ′drān)
( electricity) The current taken from a voltage source by a load. Also known as drain.
Last edited by willworkforbeer; 06-24-2009 at 04:09 PM.
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06-24-2009, 04:06 PM
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#8
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strat hd
Trade:
framing contractor , remodeler , GC occasionally
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NW Ohio
Posts: 1,673
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I just got the popcorn going......... 
__________________
STRAT HD
Disgruntled citizen of North Mexico !! 
(Formerly the USA)
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The Following User Says Thank You to strathd For This Useful Post:
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06-24-2009, 04:30 PM
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#9
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willworkforbeer
I know why my light isnt working, I killed all power to it! The homeowner is fine with it, no problems.
If you dont know what a current drain is I dont know how you could be an electrician.
′kər·ənt ′drān)
(electricity) The current taken from a voltage source by a load. Also known as drain.
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You mean like, "what's the drain level value of that light bulb?"
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06-24-2009, 04:38 PM
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#10
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Home Depot aisle walker
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home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
You mean like, "what's the drain level value of that light bulb?"
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You  Me  You after driving in front of me 
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06-24-2009, 04:46 PM
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#11
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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Breaker off, problem solved. 
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06-24-2009, 04:55 PM
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#12
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
Breaker off, problem solved. |
No  , breaker on, problem solved.
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06-24-2009, 05:01 PM
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#13
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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How did you solve the problem when you don't even know what you're talking about?
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06-24-2009, 05:02 PM
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#14
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ampman
Trade:
providing pathways for electrons and protons
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: central florida
Posts: 721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willworkforbeer
No , breaker on, problem solved. |
i must have got here late
__________________
T.Boone Pickens " by buying foreign oil we are funding both sides of the war "
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06-24-2009, 05:04 PM
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#15
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God Bless America
Trade:
Electrician
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Rahway, New Jersey
Posts: 3,334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ampman
i must have got here late
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See if strathd will share his popcorn with you.
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06-24-2009, 05:07 PM
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#16
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strat hd
Trade:
framing contractor , remodeler , GC occasionally
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NW Ohio
Posts: 1,673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
See if strathd will share his popcorn with you. |
No problem, getting ready to start the grill too ! I'll be right back, gotta go get a beer.
__________________
STRAT HD
Disgruntled citizen of North Mexico !!
(Formerly the USA)
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06-24-2009, 05:08 PM
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#17
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ampman
Trade:
providing pathways for electrons and protons
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: central florida
Posts: 721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
See if strathd will share his popcorn with you. |
__________________
T.Boone Pickens " by buying foreign oil we are funding both sides of the war "
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06-24-2009, 05:17 PM
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#18
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Home Depot aisle walker
Trade:
home remodeling
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tulsa OK
Posts: 906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnettica
How did you solve the problem when you don't even know what you're talking about?
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I guess that apartment I panel installed and wired last winter wired itself, sheesh. Dude your little wiring stuff is simple technically. Try wiring an entire car from scratch or work on a cars computerized fuel system. I knew more about electronics when I was 13 then you do now.
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06-24-2009, 05:19 PM
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#19
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Pro
Trade:
electrician Phoenix AZ
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 529
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Quote:
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What do you think, was this a power drain?
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No.
Light didn't work.
No power consumed.....until you touched it
Power was going to the light, thru the light and TRYING to get back to "ground" via the metal facia. Path/circuit wasn't complete until you completed it. You must have been grounded somehow.
__________________
Just because it's within code doesn't make it safe.
Just because it's against code doesn't make it unsafe.
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06-24-2009, 05:25 PM
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#20
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ampman
Trade:
providing pathways for electrons and protons
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: central florida
Posts: 721
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when you showed up on our job and claimed electronics knowledge all you got was the shovel
__________________
T.Boone Pickens " by buying foreign oil we are funding both sides of the war "
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