Mesh Tape Question???

Murphy

I have read a bunch of posts where it seems like everyone hates the mesh tape. Why? I have used it about a hundred times and never had any trouble. I never use it in corners but I have used it on ceilings for third floors and garage finishes.
Is it going to be ok on the ceiling because no one is walking on top of the floors.
What is the reasoning behind it being garbage?
Murph

Greg Di

Murphy,

Take much of what you read here with a grain of salt. There are a lot of people posting with alleged authority about subjects they know nothing about.

With that being said, there is nothing wrong with mesh tape PROVIDED you bed it with a SETTING COMPOUND. It will not hold up using any sort of premix mud. 90% of people do not know this and thus think the tape does not work or have issues with it. These people don't read directions!

Personally, I use mesh on all the flats and paper in the corners. Use setting compound for the first two coats and finish with medium weight premix.

I'm actually working with an editor from a major trade publication on an article called "The Remodeler's Drywall Survival Tooklit" at the moment, so there is obviously a lot more to elaborate on.

Mesh tape IS OK...You heard it from me!

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Murphy

Thanks man I was picturing call back galore. I always use setting compounds so I hope no worries there. I just wanted to make sure.
Thanks

theworx

Just posting to add a little pepper to the grains of salt that you should be taking. Nice Golf shirt and truck Greg (you look nice). I'm just replying because I know nothing about taping (after doing it for 20 years).

Murphy. grab a piece of paper from your printer. Hold it on both sides. Pull down with your right hand and up with your left hand. Can you flex the paper??? No!!! Ok, go grab some mesh tape and try the same thing. Does it flex, well what do you know, it does!!! Do you really believe that applying a compound that hardens and can crumble if movement happens over a material that can flex is a good idea? I don't care if you coat it with concrete, if any movement in the structure you're using it in happens, you'll get cracks...

Recently, I've seen places I taped (with paper) and there was a lot of movement in the structure (cottages heaved by frost). Oddly enough, none of my seams cracked, but the actual drywall had cracks at pressure points. You would think the joints would crack, but they didn't. Guess what, I used paper tape.

So please take what I've said with a grain of salt. I'm currently working on a job retaping every seam and corner because the last contractor used mesh tape. Cracks everywhere!!!

Greg, I hope that article you are working on is for Home Owners. I'm guessing your warranty for your work is a long one (as long as the customers driveway). And please realize there are actually people on this forum with many years experience and do know what they are talking about. You heard it from me...

Greg Di

TheWorx,

I have personally never had an issue with mesh tape cracking, therefor I feel confident in saying that mesh tape, when used properly, is a good product.

Obviously, if you are taping a house that has not been dried in and may experience a lot of movement, you have problems to worry about. Paper tape may be stronger, but if an entire house is settling so badly that the joints are popping, then I highly doubt even paper tape will hold up.

I did not mean to insult anyone's experience here, it's just that the BS tends to fly wildly on this site in particular, and I see a lot of posters who claim to be "painters" posting in the carpentry forum, "masons" giving advice about drywall, etc...

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Frankawitz

Well I have 27 years in the plastering and painting trades and I do all repair work and I have redone allot of repairs were mesh tape was used, and it cracks, Because the House exspands and contracts thru out the year , it has nothing to do with settling. I have worked in houses that were 60 years old and someone came in to repair stress cracks and they use mesh tape and in 6 months the cracks come back but now they have little checker board patterns, I read somewhere that paper tape rips at 22 pounds per square inch of pressure. so I would think paper tape will last longer and besides that if it does crack the mud doesb't fall out the holes like the mesh does. and if there are masons telling someone how to do plumbing or any other trade telling someone how to do something I would think a person would listen to someone in that trade not someone who works in another area of construction.

ProWallGuy

I don't do whole drywall jobs, only hole repairs/patchwork. I've always used the mesh tape, and no problems so far. I did hear though that contrary to popular belief, the paper tape proves to be stronger than mesh under stress tests.

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Mike Finley

With all due

sidejobs

I did a custom texture in my own garage were I taped and mudded to a level 3 finish. After that I apply mud (all purpose dry wall compound) with a rubber float at about an 1/8 of an inch over the entire surface. I waited for the compound to set until the desired consistency (about two beers). When the mud is ready I take a heavy masons brush and dap the entire area by touching the mud and pulling straight back. Then again more waiting, then I take a plastic knockdown knife and knockdown in a crisscross pattern. Last step is letting the mud dry completely then sanding the whole wall (the final resoult is a steco look). The point to this lengthy post is that on the first wall I did I used mesh tape and it crack on three seams. I was not happy with the cracking so one the next wall I used paper tape, no cracking. In my opinion paper all the way.

Danahy

Paper on cracks and seams, mesh on holes?

I'd love to see this thread continue with more stories where people have used both...

Mike Finley

I don't own

Classic Drywall

Ok, I guess I'll give my grains of salt here. I have been in the drywall business for 19 years (not an old schooler but not my first rodeo). I have only used fiberglass (mesh) tape a couple of times and did not like it. I did not get tons of cracks or tape and mud falling off walls just did not like the way it coats or THE COST. If I used mesh tape in all of our houses and did my first two coats in durabond brown bags (most expensive) or even if I used the lite I would go broke. The cost of the mesh along is reason not to use it, and then add in the cost of durabond vs. the cost of A/P and you can find all the reasons you need right there not to use it. Now if it's just for repairs I guess go for it, me I just use paper tape and 5 min. durabond lite for repairs. I believe this is a forum of contractors so the bottom line should be the bottom line. How can you afford the use mesh tape and durabond for the first two coats on all your jobs ? Maybe I'm just cheap and with todays pricing need to save where ever I can.

Joe....

Greg Di

Thanks, Mike for referreeing this thread.

Classic, from a remodeler's standpoint, setting compound is the only way to go regardless of cost. Unless it takes you a full day of running tape (like in a wholenew house), there is no way you can be profitable with paper tape and premix mud while you're staring at it waiting to dry.

I am able to hang, set tape, and apply two additional coats (including my finish coat) of mud in ONE DAY on a typical bathroom by myself. I think I'm doing OK efficiency-wise. What would my cost/profit be if I lost a whole day for every coat?

In fact, my drywall sub who I use for anything bigger than, say a kitchen, uses mesh and setting compound for ALL his work, because it's more efficient. I never computed it, but I would think that the labor and time savings more than offsets the additional cost of materials.

The are many, many instances when we pay more for a product because it's better, faster or saves labor. Why wouldn't you do the same for drywall?

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Teetorbilt

I find the mesh best here, I attribute it to the humidity which generally hovers around 80%. A lot of homes here are open for a good portion of the year and only close up for a month or two during the winter and about 4 months during the summer. There can be large humidity swings in a short time during the transitions.

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FleshnerDrywall

I dont know if paper is better than mess,but in new construction i prefer paper with a banjo or bazoka alot faster. Ive been doing drywall for over 10 years now i agree with Greg Di. New construction paper and remodel mess ecept for the inside corners ive went to a paper/metal bead for the inside corners. Just my two cents.

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pruane

That reminds me i need to find a good plaster guy. I use both, no real reason sometimes i do sometimes i dont, results seem to be the same.

PlainPainter

I am confused - I thought that paper was the way to go when using sheetrock and mud. I have seen in my own house where mesh was used in the corners along with premixed mud and 15 years later the corners are all coming apart. Yet in other rooms where the corners were done with the paper tape and mud - it's flawless, you can even see in some cases that there was some movement in the house and there is a little buckling of the paper - but it's still firm and intact. Now I don't have much experience with setting type compounds. But I have trained myself in the last few years to put up blueboard and then skim with veneer plaster - and when I do that I put the mesh everywhere, not paper tape. And everything holds up flawlessly - this setting type compound sounds like it would be similar to the uni-kal plaster that I use, in which case how come mesh is bad then? But yeah when I do plain ol' rock and mud - I use pre-mixed joint compounds that come in green lidded 5 gallon buckets and I use paper tape - but plaster
I use the fiberglass mesh.

-plainpainter

Greg Di

Well, there you go. Premix was used with mesh tape and it failed. Someone didn't follow the directions and look what happens.

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Classic Drywall

Ok I guess if your doing remodels, which I do very little of, I do mostley houses and commerical work. When we hit a house thats 12,000 ft. of board (250 12' boards) the only way to go is use paper tape and A/P mud. Plus we always use a banjo or bozaka pending on which crew I'm with that day. As far as watching mud dry never happens get the house taped out and get to the next one. So I guess from my stand point It would cost me a ton of money to have guys hand taping with mesh tape and coating with durabond. Tape with banjo or bozaka and coat with flat boxes.

Joe...........

Drywalller

I have been taping with mesh tape and setting compounds for 20 years.
It is a faster method of taping,I use a banjo and paper tape for internal corners.
When you apply mesh your first coat flat joints are done,and then you apply second coat over mesh the same day,1 more coat of lite weight mud over setting compound and its finished.As far as being more expensive,its not,A bag of GP setting compound is equivalent as a bucket of mud and costs the same here.Mesh might cost a little more but out ways the labor savings by far,Also drying factors are not a issue.
I also only use a non sandable dura bond and never had a call back.l