I'm getting a pool installed and I've had about 4 masonry estimates and have received about 4 different answers regarding whether or not to lay a 3" slab or tamp sand, crushed concrete, etc. to lay the pavers on.
The guy in favor of a slab is guaranteeing his job for 10 years becuase he insists that his method is that good. The guys in favor of sand insist that theirs is the best way as long as they are there upon install to tamp the heck out of the sand around the pool.
Prices are all over the map - anywhere from 10-14 per square foot. I live on Long Island NY
We are trying to avoid having a pool with dirt around it for 6 months to a year.
I would think it depends on the type of pool in some ways. If it is a steel wall pool tamping around it's perimeter is discouraged because it could damage the walls and the plumbing.
Flowable fill is a good option. Expensive but will give the best guarantee of no settling.
Another option would be to put a 6" slab around the perimeter low enough to allow for your pavers. 3" would be inadequate in my opinion.
I, like the overwhelming majority of masonry/hardscape contractors, do not charge by the square foot. There are way too many variables.
You have also omitted give us more info on your project, like the size, type of pavers, etc., which are some of the things one needs to figure out pricing...............
1) in ground vinyl liner pool, 24x44 mountain lake (free form) concrete foundation
2) Maybe not really 4 answers--I was being sarcastic--but actually 2 masons told me concrete slab (3" deep) around perimiter of pool--pinned to the foundation of the pool. and some sort of "pillar" technique. The other two said that they recomend installing the pavers on tamped sand with some sort of crushed concrete base. The paves would be installed right after the pool gets installed.
3) Material: Have not finalized yet, but probably Cambridge tumbled pavers--not sure of size, but would guess 3 or 4" pavers?? Approximately 1000 square feet.
By the way, the masons I spoke to each sort of threw out a aq foot number. That's where I got the 10-14 per sq ft figures. One of the masons said "pavers go anywhere from 12-16 per sq ft.
Pavers are usually dry set over 1"stone dust, over a well compacted 6" crushed run base, and polymeric sand as a joint filler, no need to have a slab , if done properly, pavers are a nice choice, but if you have any doubts about them, you should consider stamped concrete instead.
Good Luck!
Thanks for the replies...Ruskent, I am not a mason, would you mind explaining your comment so that I can speak intelligently with the masons? If I should be looking for this to be done a certain way, I want to be able to ask for it.
You can either backfill the pool with flowable fill which is a a slurry mix that comes in a redi mix truck. It cured to 99% compaction and you can dig it out any time. Or use 3/4 crushed stone.
What Rusk is saying is backfill the pool with either flowable fill (This is sold by most concrete companies and is poured like concrete) or fill with 3/4" clean gravel. If your pool is a vinyl liner then you have either steel walls or or some kind of poly wall. Either way you need to be carefull if you tamp the fill. Flowable fill will not need to be tamped.
On top of the gravel install geofabric. This will prevent any sand from leaching into the gravel. On top of the fabric goes the standard paver base- 6" compaceted abc gravel then 1" sand then the pavers.
One advantage of pouring a concrete apron is that your coping stone would have something substantial to adhere to.
Concrete INTERLOCKING pavers are intended to be a flexible system. Pouring a concrete pad (placing a flexible system over a rigid pad) defeats the purpose.
As far as the issue of compaction around the pool, the pool installer should have addressed this with flowable fill or 3/4 stone as Matt described.
The only time I have ever seen interlocking pavers installed on concrete is when there will be vehicle traffic on them. You can not say putting pavers on concrete is wrong it is just not the usual practice, since most cases it is not needed and would not be cost effective.
Agreed brickie. The notion that you can't put pavers over concrete is absurd. Never seen a flexible paver. What are the pavers going to get upset if they are not flexing.:no:
Flexible paveMENT, not paver. That is exactly what ICP are engineered to be. You can certainly put them over concrete, but it is not required for vehicular traffic, even very heavy high cycle areas like shipping docks.
I did not mean to imply that it was required where there would be vehicle traffic. Just that the only time I have seen or installed pavers on concrete was in that situation.To say that doing it this way is wrong is not correct. That must be one fancy loading dock:shifty:.
Maybe its just the freeze thaw cycles here, but I look at a lot of side walks and patios that are sunken and seperating and they look like crapola. The ones that stand up over time and look like something you want your friends to see are placed on top of concrete. JMHO
So the pool is actually a poured concrete form, so the pressure caused by backfilling should not be an issue. What I am hearing is that I should have the pool walls bacfilled with flowable fill or gravel. What I am most worried about, being the naive homeowner, is that they will backfill with the dirt/sand that they dug up when they create the pool. I assume this will settle??
Armed with this information, I can at least ask the questions and challenge them. We'll see how it goes.
best base for pool deck is to let it sit for aleast 1 year , then compact it well, install about 4' of cruched rca , then 4
' concrete base with wire mesh . it cost more for material , but cuts job in half, 1000 sqf pool , usally takes us about 5-6 days on rca , and 3-4 on concrete base . 70% of pools installed on Long Island are done this way , in 4 years of doing it this way , not one pool has settled on us . we do about 6-7 py repairs on pavers that were installed on rca , just call consumer affairs in NY , and see what the #1 complaint is , when pavers are done around pool. concrete base , if pitched correctly is best way to go.
Steel wall vinyl liner pools are constructed with the wall sections bolted together there are A-frames attached at every joint with pads that are pinned to the ground. After everything it level and true a cement collar is poured around the out side of the pool this helps lock everything in place. The inside of the pool generally has a floor made out of vermiculite and concrete. The pool is plumed then carefully back filled. The best /right thing to do is to wait a year until everything settles before starting your deck. I you must do the deck right away; you have the option of having the pool builder install deck supports (upside down A-frames) when he putting the wall of pool together.
I have seen a lot of paver pool decks; I have never seen one that I liked. If I wanted the look of a paver deck I would conceder a stamped concrete deck.
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