Natural Thin Veneer

artisanstone

Does anyone have any pointers on laying this stuff?http://www.appstone.com/catalog/veneer
It is natural stone sawn to 1"-1.5" to be installed like frock. It is a little heavier though. I'm looking for ideas to up production and quality at the same time. I'm thinking thinset would solve bonding issues and eliminate individual buttering. This will be laid in a "drystack" style. I have 5,400 sq. ft. to install.

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

wtygart

not to sound like a msart a@@ but there is a pdf installation guide in the resources section of the manufactures site

artisanstone

Yeah, I guess I should clarify. I'm not asking how to install, I'm asking for ideas to increase both quality and production.

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

stacker

art
i have only laid the thin stone veneer once.i laid it the same as i do artifical stone.
i applied metal lath,scratch coat and came right back over it with another coat about 3/8 thick,and stuck the stone to it.

with a dry stack,i scratch a 3x3-4x4 area,and then butter each stone.making sure there is no excess mud on the rock.i dont think there is a quick way of laying it in a dry stack fashion.

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natural1

I bet you could avoid buttering the backs of the stone if you apply thinset to the wall with a notched trowel. I have seen this done with frock but have not done it myself.

artisanstone

Have you seen or heard of any downsides to this method? I'm pretty sure it requires a pretty high tech thinset, as normal thinsets will let the stone slide down the wall.

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

artisanstone

Stacker, what would you guesstimate as a good production rate for laying this stuff? Things I've considered are:
1. It's not manmade to go into patterns like frock.
2. Likely more chipping involved.
3. Slightly heavier.
4. More waste.

Thanks, Bill

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

Tscarborough

I prefer to use thinset, and if you use the right one and mix it on the dry side, it slides less than mud. Try Ardex X5. Best of all, it has a 3 hour potlife!

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Tscarborough

1. It's not manmade to go into patterns like frock. --This is an advantage
2. Likely more chipping involved.--Not much, get a rotozip with the 3" diamond blade.
3. Slightly heavier. --Not by much
4. More waste. -- I figure it the same as faux, since I find I have to cull damaged pieces of faux.

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tkle

Start from the bottom with drystack and it won't slide. Mark level lines on the wall every few feet. You may need a few shims to keep level. Use a little color in your mortar so any that shows through will blend in. Have your tender sort it to size when he brings it in.

Tscarborough

Cheapo floor tiles make good shims. Break them into 1x1 pieces.

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stacker

art
i would think that a good mason should be able to install 75-100 feet in an 8 hour day.maybe more.
i agree with tscar on the points you asked about.
there really isnt alot of difference in weight.

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artisanstone

I appreciate the input. Does anyone see enough production advantage in the thinset to be worthwhile? I think I may do two side by side tests to determine.

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

genecarp

flexbond thinset , 3/8th notch trowel, no buttering, prop up a starter strip along run, next day, pull it, your golden, also, many may disagree, but, 30lb felt, proper drainage board, wonderbaord, thinset and mesh all seams, glue and go. much time saved on scratchcoat and wire, and no problems that i am aware of........

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tkle

Yes.

Tommy C

So most of you guys just parge the wall and stick the rock on? I always back-buttered only. I feel like you get a better bond that way.

tkle

I do both.

stacker

it depends on the rock,tommy.if i am not laying it dry stack i dont butter the rock.i apply a thick enough coat of mud and stick it in.the grout it with a bag.sometimes,if i am having trouble with a rock i will butter it,but i have found in most cases it is a wasted step and not nessasary.

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life is short,do your masonry naked!!
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artisanstone

OK, some of you feel like the thinset is a good idea. Over at the tile forum, http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/index.php, most of the response has been somewhat negative. I won't start this job for a few weeks, and I do plan to build some samples to test my ideas. I'd also like to get the best advise possible in the interim. Right now, my two plans are: Thinset over scratch coat, Type S with latex over scratch coat. I was informed recently by a mason who does mainly thin veneer, that latex added to S will make it slide down the wall. ??? Can anyone confirm? Does anyone have any other brilliant ideas to up production. I don't want to mess with this stuff unless I can do it Right and Fast.
Thanks.

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Bill Baddorf
Bill@artisanstoneworks.net
www.artisanstoneworks.net
www.stonefoundation.org

Tscarborough

What does a tile guy know about faux stone? I have had to redo 2 faux stone jobs, both done by tile guys. Type S with latex IS thinset for all intents and purposes (aggregate not withstanding). If it slides, dry the mix, simple as that.

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