Brick Veneer Vs Solid Masonry

sean mccormack

I work with a builder in Chicago. We build single family frame with brick veneer homes.

I am looking for any information or articles that compare and contrasts brick veneer to solid masonry construction techniques.

Thanks

Bob Kovacs

It's VERY rare that true "solid masonry" construction is used anymore- it's too prone to cracking and moisture problems. Even in load-bearing masonry structures, a cavity wall systems is usually used, which allows water into (through) the brick veneer and out through the cavity without entering the interior of the building.

Bob

1over2

If you are in Chicago, I would contact US Heritage group. They run workshops and have info on traditional masonry and mortar techniques. The workshops focus on the use of traditional lime mortars in structural masonry buildings. They have a web site by the same name.
good luck

red_cedar

Would not 'Cinder Block' with a 'brick veneer' constitute 'solid masonry construction' such as in commercial work?

Grumpy

I'm no mason but it's my opinion that a brick verneer is like a fake rollex watch. It's not real brick... well it is rela brick but it's just a verneer, a siding. You get none of the benefits of a solid masonry structure because the house is a wood framed house. The only two benefits are curb appeal and low building cost since wood frame costs much less than a brick wall.

What red cedar described I see being used often in commercial work, condo work, and even on high end single family homes in the city of Chicago. In the suburbs it's all wood framed.

stacker

in oklahoma when the specs say brick veener,we take it to mean full brick.not the thin cut brick.

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Bob Kovacs

It's still a cavity wall system, which isn't technically "solid masonry". It is however, the prefered method to prevent moisture issues.

Bob

blockhd9

when all else fails google it or try masonry magazine then past issues you may find some info there

Tscarborough

"Veneer" in this instance is used to differentiate load bearing masonry from non-load bearing. Solid masonry would be considered multi-wythe construction tied across the wall with masonry, as opposed to metal anchoring systems (as in brick veneer with CMU backup). "Solid Masonry" can have air spaces or not.

molson360

I have issue with the current accepted belief that solid masonry walls, true multi-wythe construction with no air space, is prone to water infiltration, movement and cracking. I was trained to design masonry veneer walls and control movement and water infiltration with modern falshing and control methods but my work experiance on old masonry buildings in Chicago contradicts my training. For instance control joints, in a veneer wall they are essential, the veneer is too thin and has so little mass that it will crack especially in a climate with rapid thermal changes like the great lakes region without control joints. I was taught to believe that solid wythe will crack apart over time but let me tell you, this simply isnt true. Most solid wythe lime putty mortar walls I see that crack do so because of settlement of the foundation, parapets that are too high or havent been properly mantained or at openings that have allowed water to infiltrate for decades. By and large the solid wythe construction is more stable and less prone to cracking and movement then properly designed veneer walls. In the veneer wall the air space, in my opinion, allows for pressure and moisture differentials on the front and back surface of the veneer brick. Moisture is then moving in and out of this one brick at an increased cycle rate. In a solid brick wall the moisture permiates and diffuses much slower which I have to believe is better for the brick unit. Now that the first veneer walls are approaching 50 years + in age, we will see by direct observation the limits of the veneer wall and inherent value of solid wythe construction. Plus solid wythe allows for true masonry artful ornamentation, effectively corbeled sculpting and decoration that cant be achieved in veneer construction. Who can deny the beauty of true masonry wall construction?

Supahflid

Well said, and I agree with all of that. I think by and large the theory of cavity wall construction is sound, it's the construction that causes most of the problems. Through wall flashing being improperly installed and improper treatment of both flashing in and around fenestrations in general and improper gasket or sealant installation within curtain wall systems in particular are two of the biggest issues I see. Although improper installation of curtain wall would cause problems with either type of construction.

And I also think that multiple wythe brick masonry construction makes for an excellent skin and most of the problems I see are about age and lack of maintenance, not original construction issues.

ChristianSmith

Couldn't agree more, I replace a lintel or two almost once a week, many times I find there was zero flashing used.

stuart45

Solid masonry walls are making a comeback here, being built with 12 inch thick AAC blocks, rendered on the outside and insulated plasterboard inside.

Tscarborough

Structural solid masonry is expensive, but low tech. Total masonry construction, i.e. cavity wall construction, is cheaper, but still more expensive than the alternatives, and relies on a high level of technology and competence. Technology meaning engineering, materials, and detailing.

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cleveman

Now that the first veneer walls are approaching 50 years + in age, we will see by direct observation the limits of the veneer wall and inherent value of solid wythe construction

Have I misread this, or was the first brick veneer wall done in 1961?

lukachuki

Our English friends chuckle silently!

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cleveman

Sorry, I meant to quote this guy about the veneers being 50 years old. I'm not too good with the different features.