Basement Floor Topping

Profiter

All,
I'm in the process of building my first new home. The builder I am using has poured a poorly degraded frozen slab for my basement. The top layer seems to have frozen and now I'm looking at putting a top layer over the existing slab. I've been directed towards products such as: Level-X52 by Edison Coatings, Ardex 500 by Ardex UK, Pavecrete and use a Con-O-Lith hardening prior to Pavecrete. Any advice or experience anyone has had on using any of the above products would be greatly appreciated.
Matt

K2

If your still unfinished a jackhammer and a repour might be cheaper and save a bunch of guessing. A good flatwork crew could probably have you fixed up in two days. We tried to save a few slabs and ended up repouring anyway.

Peladu

Must have been the builders first home also.

Profiter

That's actually what I asked of the builder but they refuse to repour. They want to use this Ardex 500 latex topping but I'm not to sure of the product. I'm asking for a new slab and will probably end up with a latex topping in it's place. I've been fighting with the builder for 6 months now and I've been using a lawyer for the past 3. Should I at least ask for some money back since they are already repairing the slab. I'm suppose to be getting core samples done sometime this week to determine if the slab is below the specifications stated in the contract. If so, I do plan to take it to litigation. Any advice?

K2

This reminds me of people I know who picked the cheapest builder they could find and then wonder why they have to fight with him through the whole process. I'd pay for the repoured floor myself and move on.

Brickie

Why are you letting the builder push you & your lawyer around? I would agree with Rob 53, bust it up & redo. There is an old masonry proverb that goes:

No matter how much you try & polish a turd, it's still a turd!

__________________
“Ron Paul is one of the outstanding leaders fighting for a stronger national defense. As a former Air Force officer, he knows well the needs of our armed forces, and he always puts them first. We need to keep him fighting for our country.” – Ronald Reagan

Profiter

Well, what do you think I've been trying to do for the last 4 months? If it were as easy as punching them in the face, I would have already done that. Now that my unfinished house has been sitting for 10 months, I am ready to move on and complete the house. Besides, I don't have 20,000 extra dollars to remove and repour the whole basement floor, that's what other contractors have estimated to redo the work. I'm asking if anyone has had any experience with the products I've listed. I appreciate your concern with my fight with the builder but I'm to the point of resolution and do plan to have a 20 year guarantee on the floor per MY contract to the builder. By any chance has anyone hear used or heard of any of the above products?
Thanks,
Matt

jmic

Profiter,
Check with Denick!

__________________
___"Remember You Never Get A Second Chance To Make A First Impression"______________________
Joe

Brickie

[QUOTE=Profiter]Well, what do you think I've been trying to do for the last 4 months? If it were as easy as punching them in the face, I would have already done that. Now that my unfinished house has been sitting for 10 months, I am ready to move on and complete the house. Besides, I don't have 20,000 extra dollars to remove and repour the whole basement floor, that's what other contractors have estimated to redo the work. I'm asking if anyone has had any experience with the products I've listed. I appreciate your concern with my fight with the builder but I'm to the point of resolution and do plan to have a 20 year guarantee on the floor per MY contract to the builder. By any chance has anyone hear used or heard of any of the above products?
Thanks,
Matt[/QUOTE

Well Matt, I don't know what you've been doing for the last 4 months nor did I recommend punching anyone. I do know that when someone writes "The builder I am using has poured a poorly degraded frozen slab for my basement." one of the first things that comes to mind is "I hope the builder has insurance"

__________________
“Ron Paul is one of the outstanding leaders fighting for a stronger national defense. As a former Air Force officer, he knows well the needs of our armed forces, and he always puts them first. We need to keep him fighting for our country.” – Ronald Reagan

theworx

I'm confused, you hired a builder for your home and he screwed up the slab. Why is it not his responsibility to fix it??? You are talking about putting money out of your own pocket to repair the situation but shouldn't it be the builder responsible for his screw up??? He should replace the slab...

Profiter

Well I see your point there. I've been typing so many emails and posts that I forget who knows what and who I've talked too. Just a small briefing... The construction started in Sept., poured walls in Nov., poured slab in Dec. (temp range 10-30 degrees F), slab froze but didn't see the result due to floor trusses and subfloor installed week afterwards. (Don't ask about the 4 months it took to finish the basement, it's been a nightmare.) Basement steps installed mid Feb., Saw slab chipping for first time, stopped construction. Hired a lawyer after I felt the builder was trying to take the short route and not do what I asked which was install a new floor. Got 3 different bids from other contractors for removal and new floor install. Estimated around 20,000 for all. Builder wouldn't agree to a new floor, I threatened to take them to court but can't exactly sue due to contract restrictions. After talking to a ton of different professionals and family members, I agreed to have builder pay for core sample with eng. firm of my choice. Upon result of samples, if good, allow the recommended product of my choice to be poured by builder, if bad, they would be responsible for removal and repour but I am asking that they terminate my contract with them and allow me to choose a different builder. Obviously a lot more has gone on, it would just take a book to inform of all the details. The builder is responsible for the cost of everything, I am just trying to find out more information pertaining to the products that I initially mentioned. If the slab isn't completely frozen, I thinking about agreeing to a fix with a guarantee and a kickback since I didn't pay for sub-par work. I've been at a stopping point since Feb/March time frame and really want my house to be completed since I'm paying for rent and partial mortagage but at the same time I don't want a half-ass job done on the house. Since I've been working on this for the last 3-4 months or so I haven't had any breaking or good news that would allow me to terminate my contract or force the builder to install a new slab. If there is something that I can do or say to "make" them do what I ask of them, believe me I would do it. If anyone has any other advice I would greatly appreciate it.
Thanks jmic for the response again. I'm trying to learn as much about all of these products as I can so I can consider installing the most reliable and best quality that will satisfy my expectations.
Also, I've filed with the better business bureau and they agree with my builder that they are taking the necessary actions to correct the problems and that I am not willing to work with them since I have been asking for a new slab for about 4 months now. That isn't going to look good in court if it makes it that far. This is why I am stumped and don't really know what direction to take other than possible agreement mentioned earlier.
Thanks,
Matt

jmic

Matt,
If you haven't done it yet, get your core sample as soon as possible to determine your next form of action. If only the top froze and you are having flaking and spaulding of the top layer approx. 1/4" I,m sure the structural integridty of the concrete slab is fine and I'd just use one of the products you mentioned and then have them put a good concrete paint over the entire slab. Just my opinion. Good Luck!

__________________
___"Remember You Never Get A Second Chance To Make A First Impression"______________________
Joe

tgeb

If the slab is like 'jmic' stated maybe you could talk the builder into giving you a tile floor over that slab.
Probably would not cost much more than the ardex install, but look how much nicer.

__________________
Tom

www.gebcon.com

JIM CARROLL

I would recommend having someone come in and scarify the top of the concrete. This will do two things. It will remove any of the concrete that is not suitable and it will also prepare the surface for any of the above mentioned products. I am familiar with the products above. Ardex makes really good products however I feel that they are overpriced. Pavecrete is also a good product. However from my experience i would have contractor use a self leveling product like Sonoflow(from sonneborn) flowcrete or flowrock from the makers of Pavecrete, ardex also has a selfleveling product.

How many square feet is your basement.

I live in Myrtle beach sc and we don't have basements here, except for the ones without roofs above(swimming pools). I previously sold concrete repair products and this sound like any easy fix if the concrete is not completely detiorated(sp). do yourself a favor and call technical support for Pavecrete 214/381-8100, I can not remember the guys name, but actually he is one of the owners of the company and he could help you alot.

Around here if the concrete guy screws up the slab he is responsible for repairs. but i understand where you are coming from also.

__________________
JIM CARROLL
INLET PRESSURE CLEANING
MYRTLE BEACH SC

K2

Jim, how much frozen concrete do you get in Myrtle Beach ?? I'm sure you know the products, but, it seems to me if a slab had a pretty good freeze, there isn't much to save. Of course if there is something that can react 4 inches down I would like to hear about it.