So-called "professional" Siders.

loneframer

Framing falls into the same category. Many framers don't care to square the building, they'll trust the block walls. Many just eyeball the walls after plumbing the corners. Very few will check for bad studs on punchout. I'll be the first to tell you, I take longer than some guys to get things right, but at the end of the job we walk away even, because I'm not dealing with someone elses mistakes all the way to the top.

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Patrick

Ha, one of the lines our instructor for VSI used was "just because your grand daddy showed your father to do it this way doesnt mean thats the right way to do it"

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

MJW

There are hacks and there are cheap un-educated homeowners. Who is to blame?? Most of the time we don't know.

Sometimes even educated homeowners still just care about when it gets done, how fast, and how cheap....after all it's just siding or just shingles..

rojigga

Siding should be 80% sealing the building and 20% Cosmetics.

With that 20% the house should still look as damn good as any other house done right.

I still see siding guys and rock guys who don't have any idea about keeping that positive lap throughout, whether it be paper or flashing. That's the first thing my new guys have to learn, and they won't do a damn thing else until they do. By far the most important thing for sealing a house.

siding guy23

FINALLY someone who gets it. You can't keep water out with a little caulking. Paper is what keeps the moisture out.

Tom Struble

ah.. yea thanks for the insite actually its more than just the paper its the system as a whole and how everything interacts with each other that makes a successful installation

MattK

BEST RULE OF THUMB TO TELL HO...
I can do it fast, cheap and good.
You can now pick 2 out of 3

loneframer

I agree, paper is critical, but it must work in conjunction with proper flashing and siding details. If all three systems are not working in concert with each other, there will be a failure, guaranteed. Properly installed siding will shed water, but it will not prevent wind driven rain and the positive and negative pressures that go along with it from causing problems, paper and flashing are the only line of defense in these conditions.

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Darwin

Darn you loneframer! You pulled perfectly good siding off to expose OSB without feltpaper...

WHY???

Tom Struble

funny thing is that ive pull down vinyl with nothing behind it and the sheathing looked brand new

rojigga

...and then went ahead installing the siding without sealing the house...

totally the way to go. (IMO)

loneframer

A little gremlin called water infiltration.

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Tom Struble

huh?

loneframer

That is because there was no Tyvek to trap moisture between IT and the sheathing.

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loneframer

There was not much water damage to the sheathing in this case either, but it didn't prevent the water from rolling out of the gas fireplace. Of coarse, it only happened when it rained.

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MJW

If you have OSB, you have moisture no matter what. Problem is, that the water is not on the wall....it is in the wall. OSB doesn't breathe and doesn't dry from the inside out.

Tom Struble

with all the layers of waterproof glue in plywood id question its ability to ''breathe'' also. Maybe the reason with alot the osb problems [besides the crummy nail holding] are because of the shoddy workmanship seen in this thread.Which most likely are the result of a hurry up and get it done mindset

In those pic of Loneframers i think most of the problem was caused by a poor chimney cap,which really is the fireplace guys detail.

Around here they use a galvanized sheet metal that rustout in a few years

loneframer

The cap was definitely the culprit, I replaced it with a heavy gauge aluminum one that counterflashed the siding and cornerposts. I just believe the siders should have done more to manage the water properly.

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loneframer

I always gap me sheathing no matter what it is, the gapping inadvertantly aids the ability of the wall to breathe and expel moisture.
Just a framing CARPENTERS view on the matter.

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Tom Struble

oh i definitely agree,theres a way that it should have been done and it wasnt,simple as that,you never know when your work is going to be removed by someone,and it dosnt really matter why, but if what you did wasnt right you look like the hack.Which i guess you are if you do work like that