Problem Customer

Originally Posted by tomstruble

do you guys run your gable facia seams backwards too?
if yes why? if not why?
for what its worth i was also taught to place the upper piece
of corner into the lower one also,i always belived not much water will get in and be a problem

i try not to reverse lap anything anymore
and i use this as a selling point against my competition

Originally Posted by tomstruble

i was taught to face them away also,then one day i was folding a corner
in the rain and was wondering why the sleave on my sweat shirt was filling up with watermore water gets in thru the seams than i thought

Originally Posted by tomstruble

no disrespect buddy but its that ''it doesn't matter'' attitude that put your homeowner in the spot he's in today,whether it was cause by your installers or not,that kind of attitude is alot of the reason vinyl siding has the bad rap it has

if nothing seems to matter on your siding ,i would wonder what your
tyvek job underneath looks like

Originally Posted by DavidC

I keep reading this thread hoping one day Buddy will post the final resolution. FWIW, I don't think the customer has much of a leg to stand on.

It's a fine point but, to install house wrap we poke it full of holes to nail it up. Then we poke it with even more holes when we install the siding. The siding nails don't have the head to help seal the hole. Any one or any number of these holes can become an entry point for water. I doubt that it is the cause in this case based on the photos provided. If you corner flashed behind that corner post it wouldn't matter which way you lapped the seams, you could leave gaps if you wanted. Proper flashing remains the most effective means of protection.

Good Luck
Dave

Originally Posted by TimNJ

Buddy, I hope you are doing all your contact attempts in writing. Even if you call him it should be followed by a letter (certified, return receipt) for documentation if this ever does go any where. I would send him a certified letter documenting all the times you have tried to contact him and in the last line something to the tune of...."since I have not received any responses after the numerous attempts to contact you, I am considering this claim closed."
That letter will force him to either "sh*t or get off the pot".

Originally Posted by TimNJ

Buddy, I hope you are doing all your contact attempts in writing. Even if you call him it should be followed by a letter (certified, return receipt) for documentation if this ever does go any where. I would send him a certified letter documenting all the times you have tried to contact him and in the last line something to the tune of...."since I have not received any responses after the numerous attempts to contact you, I am considering this claim closed."
That letter will force him to either "sh*t or get off the pot".

Originally Posted by buddy110

Funny. I came in this morning, wrote a quick letter sent copies of all our correspondence via certified mail. He called me about 20 minutes ago apologizing. He had a huge blow out with the his carpenters over a few different things and in the process came to realize they were trying to rake him over the coals. He discovered a few things that they claimed to have done but never actually did. I guess he did the math and figure it out...

As I suspected they were out of work carpenters looking for a meal ticket.

Originally Posted by buddy110

Funny. I came in this morning, wrote a quick letter sent copies of all our correspondence via certified mail. He called me about 20 minutes ago apologizing. He had a huge blow out with the his carpenters over a few different things and in the process came to realize they were trying to rake him over the coals. He discovered a few things that they claimed to have done but never actually did. I guess he did the math and figure it out...

As I suspected they were out of work carpenters looking for a meal ticket.

Originally Posted by Framer53

So much for the road trip!

Originally Posted by buddy110

2 years ago, I did a reside for a very rich, pompous and rather unsociable client here in NY. You know the type, old money, snooty people who look down their nose at you as if you're a lowly nobody. It's on a 300 acre horse farm. You get the picture..We sided his horse barn and a modest cottage that was built about 20 years ago. It's a red job and looks really nice.

The cottage had wood, novelty siding on it (like a modern dutchlap). The existing window trim and corner boards were installed "over top" of the siding, assumably because it was easier than cutting the siding precisely to fit?? Due to the fact that the existing siding was laying flat and to keep the cost down for the customer we went over top, removing only the corner boards so the vinyl corners would be flush with our wall. The window trim presented a nice, solid edge to butt our "J" channel up to. We trimmed the windows (they used a 1X6 around the perimeter) and caulked everything with a white silicone. Under the original siding is an OSB substrate covered with tyvek. (we know this now, not then).

Fast forward to two+ months ago. We get a call from our client claiming that our install allowed rain to get in and rot the wall under his front window. HUH??? After numerous failed attempts to schedule a face to face with him my project manager takes it upon himself to visit the job, remove 4 courses of siding under the window in question. As expected the wall was intact with no visible rot. A few weeks later our client calls again and puts me in touch with his carpenter whom is installing new windows (oh boy....) Our client expresses to me that his carpenter feels our installation has caused this rot. So we speak on the phoneand after looking at emailed pictures it was clear to me his wall was in fact rotted badly. The sill plate was shot, the perimeter around the window (under the old 1x6 trim) was also rotted and the wall directly beneath the window is in really bad shape. The OSB is disintegrating. The conversation ensues and the carpenter and I "seem" to agree that this was not caused by my install. That in fact this kind of rot take years to happen and was most likley do to the old trim never being flashed properly. All we did was cover the trim that was in place, which showed no visible rot.

Fast forward again to this week. I get another call from our client. He asks me to come out and meet his carpenter. We agree on yesterday and I head out there. I get there and the conversation immediately switches from the windows to the vinyl corner pieces being installed improperly. Technically he's right because upper corner was installed and seamed away from view. IOW slipped into not over top of the bottom corner. Ok fine..even though it was a snug fit with no opening on the face and a small opening in the pocket I'll agree, it should have been over top. (I only know this from pictures as he has already R&R'd corner and repaired rot which as you'll see, he decides to blame me for) Now he states that because of this minor infraction, the OSB substrate, which was covered by the novelty siding, tyvek, my insulating/leveling board and the new, vinyl siding was rotted 8" on either side of the corner. He had to remove the entire wall, repair the rot, replace insulation and install new plywood and reinstall the vinyl. As I'm looking at the wall, I notice that there are at least 6 courses of siding reinstalled and left short of the corner pocket. One piece is actually protruding and buckling because it's hitting the edge of the corner. The new trim around his windows is horrendous and will most certainly leak again.. These so called vinyl experts are skilled/experienced enough to deduce this damage was caused by my installation, but not skilled/experienced enough to install siding correctly. LOL It gets better...

Ok, So I ask... Why did you wait until this was all done to call me? No answer.. I ask again Why?? The carpenter pipes up.. "I'm not going to leave a wall open".. I'm thinking...What???? I'm 20 minutes away. I have a staff of 20 people. Are you joking? We would drop everything in a heart beat and be there immediately. Then the proverbial threat from the client. " well it's like this. Either offer some compensation or I'll take you to court"... Give me a break!! I'm being labeled as a fall guy for the original builder. This rot was there long before I got there. Never miond that my contract specifically excludes any damage to any substrate regardless of cause. Of course this could be challenged but I feel I'm pretty well covered.

So I need your opinions. Is this sort of rot in two short years possible given these circumstances.

Thanks for reading and any comments are appreciated