Are my guys taking tooo long ??? - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

assembleinstall · 05-21-2007, 01:54 PM

I got two guys doing new construction window /door installs , typically 17 single windows, maybe 2 or 3 twin or triple windows and maybe 4 single exterior doors. They right now are taking about 10 hours to complete this and I think I'm losing money. We are subs for a large builder so he pays by the window and door. When we bid on the project , we figured we could do 2 house per day and as you can see we are doing one house and sometimes it takes 1.5 days. So the question is how long does it typically take for your crews and how many people do you have in a crew ?

tcleve4911 · 05-21-2007, 04:01 PM

2 man crew. 10 hours to install 40 windows & 8 doors on 2 separate jobsites?

Did you account for set up?Staging? Did you really think you could go balls to walls for 10 hours a day 5 days a week?
It all depends on how much detail and workmanship you want to put into it. With your estimate, I'd say there is time for little or no quality.

I think 2 guys are doing great to install 20 some odd windows & 4 doors in a day and you want them to do that in a morning? Get real!!!!! You can't have ANY quality install doing it that fast!!!
It sounds like you underbid it.

WNYcarpenter · 05-21-2007, 04:08 PM

It's hard to say, is there staging set for them on upper windows? Are you using an unfamiliar product? Is the builder asking for a more deliberate installation than you figured (xtra flashing details)? Are the ROs built to the correct size? Are the windows stored in an inconvenient place? Are there other tradesmen in the way? What does your foreman have to say?

If you bid the job knowing what two guys were doing the installs then you most likely have good reason to think they're taking to long, but again if you are confident with your installers there's probably outside factors involved.

Mike Finley · 05-21-2007, 05:09 PM

Start basing all or some of your guys pay on per window or per door and watch productivity increase.

assembleinstall · 05-21-2007, 06:21 PM

Well a couple of things ...builder's framers suck and RO's are rarely the correct size , so they spend a lot of time fixing them. Second we will have some times when some of the windows are not there, sent to the wrong site. But to me that is normal cost of doing business but right now we are doing pretty basic windows. The foreman for the site thinks we are the best he has seen in a long time and it has helped us to win more sites for the summer. So they are doing quality work but as we get more and more jobs I don’t want to set us up for failure. I need to bounce this off of more experienced guys because we have only been in business for one year and I’m the business side with a degree in business, so efficiencies is what I am about but want to be realistic to my crew as well ...bid properly so they have the time and I can make the money we need to survive and be successful

WNYcarpenter · 05-22-2007, 06:51 PM

Can you add upcharge clauses into your contract to cover time spent resolving jobsite issues. X amount for fixing incorrect ROs, windows not being on site etc... It sounds like you're building a good repore with this GC so keep doing what you're doing. Piece work will light a fire under your employees, but in some instances could lead to sloppy installs.

Being in business for just a year doesn't provide you with much data to compare your bids. I'm willing to say most successful contractors here don't compare their bids with others because they offer something the others don't. They compare themselves with what they've done in the past. Over time with good records you should be able to isolate inefficiencies on your part and charge for other's lack of. As long as your work is considered the best keep it up, good luck to you!