How To Use A Brake?

 
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Old 02-15-2006, 08:29 AM   #1
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How To Use A Brake?


I know a lot of you are knowledgeable on the use of a brake. We have never really needed to know how to use one ourselves but that is going to change. We are going to start doing our own siding and exterior finish work on our projects (starting small and up from there).

I have never been taught to use one and would like to know if there is any lit. out there that any of you could recommend. I don't have anyone to teach me either. I figure I will just have to learn from books and doing (I figure there will be lots of scrap coil stock in my future).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
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Old 02-15-2006, 08:51 AM   #2
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


for making alot of pieces like big window capping jobs I cut my coil stock to 8' long set my slitter to the overall width of item to be capped and slit all the stock to width. stack all the pieces tightly together and mark your bend points at both ends of the top piece, using a sharp awl and a hammer punch all your bend points this will transfer a mark through all your pieces then start bending, makes short work of production bending and very accurate results, hope this helps.

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Old 02-15-2006, 09:02 AM   #3
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Quote:
Originally Posted by sage
I know a lot of you are knowledgeable on the use of a brake. We have never really needed to know how to use one ourselves but that is going to change. We are going to start doing our own siding and exterior finish work on our projects (starting small and up from there).

I have never been taught to use one and would like to know if there is any lit. out there that any of you could recommend. I don't have anyone to teach me either. I figure I will just have to learn from books and doing (I figure there will be lots of scrap coil stock in my future).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Sage email me your address to cwc@crosswindsconstruction.com. It just so happens I have ample knowlege on this brake subject. I fabbed all my own coil on all my jobs.

I will show you how to measure and the layouts for everything you need.
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:30 AM   #4
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Quote:
Originally Posted by sage
I know a lot of you are knowledgeable on the use of a brake. We have never really needed to know how to use one ourselves but that is going to change. We are going to start doing our own siding and exterior finish work on our projects (starting small and up from there).

I have never been taught to use one and would like to know if there is any lit. out there that any of you could recommend. I don't have anyone to teach me either. I figure I will just have to learn from books and doing (I figure there will be lots of scrap coil stock in my future).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Good snips are the most important. For facia I have seen it done many ways I like to do the eave first with flange running up the gable end then install the gable piece. Gable piece if cut long will buckle once gutter goes on. It sounds like you are doing new construction which is a lot easier to learn on then old sagging houses. Dark colors are harder to work with because of expansion /contraction, don't over nail them. I use aluminum nails where you might need to drill them out otherwise exclusivly use the stainless steel. Or just tack the nails until your sure you love it, then send them all home. Do you have a coil roller, I made mine. Try not to face nail as much as possible....

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Old 02-15-2006, 09:39 AM   #5
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Keep'em come'n guys. I'll take whatever I can.
I know just enough to know that I don't know. And that's pushing it.

TIA
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:41 AM   #6
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


practice makes perfect!
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:45 AM   #7
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Quote:
Originally Posted by sage
Keep'em come'n guys. I'll take whatever I can.
I know just enough to know that I don't know. And that's pushing it.

TIA
What kind of bending are you starting out doing??? Is it new construction???

Bob
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:48 AM   #8
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


We do some work in new construction but mainly we do remodeling. I think I would need to learn all aspects. I am near completely green with all of this. Where it would come into play is when we do additions and such.
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:50 AM   #9
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


I havent started doing any bending yet. I don't know enough to start. My only experience is from trade shows and watching my subs do it, but even then I never really payed much attention.
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Old 02-15-2006, 02:08 PM   #10
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


If you are asking how to use siding tools why ask in the carpentry section when there is a siding section?

Hire a sub and watch what he does, then you try it on your next small job.
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Old 02-15-2006, 03:23 PM   #11
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


When you cap wood/trim, like a c bend, bend just a hair big on each leg, then when you install, you should feel the vacume/presure from the air escaping benieth. That's a perfect fit. Nail around the corners on each leg and leave the face nice and clean.

When you cut on the brake, start from each end, an overscore can put wear on the brake jaw henge.

Keep a clipboard handy to draw your bends and write down your measurments unless the job is small.

Don't man handle your coil or bends. It's a true art.

Bob
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Old 02-15-2006, 03:51 PM   #12
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


[QUOTE=Glasshousebltr

Keep a clipboard handy to draw your bends and write down your measurments unless the job is small.

Don't man handle your coil or bends. It's a true art.

Bob[/QUOTE]

Plan your bends, sometimes if you start on the wrong side you won't be able to finish the piece.
BUT!!! once you get the hang of it it's fun and goes quick.

Be patient, learn from your mistakes and it will all come together
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Old 02-15-2006, 04:56 PM   #13
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Don't try to fit it tight. I "hang" my fascia rather than trying to get it real tight to wood. If there is a bow in the wood you are capping and you push the coil in tight it will cause it to bubble out. Also, if you are doing the wood work underneath try to keep your widths down to maybe the 6" area and then add another level to break up the sight line. Nothing looks tackier than a 1x12 capped flat, IMO.

If you haven't done so already, buy a good break not just the cheapo basic and get the rolling slitter for cutting the coil, it's worth it's weight in gold.

Last edited by TimNJ; 02-15-2006 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 02-15-2006, 05:07 PM   #14
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


I hope you guys don't get pssssed, but how did you learn? It seems like this is truely an art and not a cut dry type of thing. I need to start with the basics like what part of a window capping would you start with, Top or sides. I am NO DIY, but I have no experience with this type of work and can't seem to find a place to start. I don't intend to jump right in and pork any clients as I and We are not in the business of guessing.

Adam M. has offered his help in the fab end of things, For which I am grateful,(I'm sure Adam could, but I don't want to take too much of his time) but can anyone direct me in the application end. Maybe not, Maybe you don't want too, I understand. I know the people on his forum have more knowledge than time to type. I have looked and searched for literature on the topic, but have run into dead ends. I have asked my subs who I thought I had good relations with and were friends to teach me but the answer is NO, for obvious reasons.

Where to start? I am not exactly in the position to start with a siding company as an employee. Although that would be great!

TIA!
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Last edited by sage; 02-15-2006 at 06:36 PM.
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Old 02-15-2006, 05:08 PM   #15
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


The most important thing that I think about when making bends (no one here has mentioned, maybe its obvious) is that the metal should help keep water off of the wooden trim. I've been on many jobs where the metal covers the trim is such a way that it traps water causing the wood to rot.
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Old 02-15-2006, 06:35 PM   #16
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy
If you are asking how to use siding tools why ask in the carpentry section when there is a siding section?

Hire a sub and watch what he does, then you try it on your next small job.
Sorry Grumpy, Didnt see the siding section when I started this. Thought that this was falling under the scope of carpentry. I'm a carpenter but don't no shiat about this.
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Old 02-15-2006, 06:53 PM   #17
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Does the fact I had to custom make EVERY piece that covered the exterior of this addition out of coil stock qualify me on a brake? except soffit that was store bought dont ask about colors LOL, what homie wants homie gets


Seriously though, I'm sure most of us here id not just walk upto a brake and start making bends. I worked with my grandfather for years braking all his diagrams/measurements...that takes some time itself getting that all figured out especially once you get into 4-6 bends in one piece. I'm alot better now after 16yrs of doing it, but I screwd up quite a bit. then once you figure out what your doing bending it, installing it is a whole nother beast in itself if you do it correctly and bend all the pieces to flash themselves, namely sill to side pieces and the top over the sides so there is no way water can get into the joints.

This is NOT something your going to be good at and there is no way your going to be proficent with it for a LOOONG time, as stated, it is an art and one which I hate since it's soo friggin tedious. I do kick azz metal work and have even helped buddies do interior work on race cars, but on the job I've found a few crews that actually do a good job for less than I charge out, so I just figure double that price when figuring a job so I still get paid for capping even though sometimes I dont.

If you know ANYBODY with experience, it's in your best intrest to take a day off and help them, explaining and books will get you so far, hands on is the only way to get it right...as well as screwing up alot of aluminum.

Too many variable with each application to give a sure fired way since typically every job has it's own quirks you have to overcome.

at a minimum get a pro II or pro III brake, we've got a 8' for window/door jobs, but I like my 10.5' for doing bay's/bows since I can wrap the entire top/bottom with one seamless peice. DO NOT get one of those old azzed single lever models with the lever on one end to lock it all down...you'll really be pizzed off since hitting your mark is critical for bending and trying to get the piece into position before locking the jaw down while standing at one end...just flat out sucks, had to use one on a job one day i did'nt have my stuff with me and almost threw it in the street for the guy with a quarter taped to it, so if somebody picked it up they'd have something LOL!!

sorry wasnt more help, just trying to be honest so you know what to expect.

Josh

Last edited by IHI; 02-15-2006 at 06:59 PM.
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Old 02-15-2006, 07:35 PM   #18
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


The first time I used a brake I was capping 6 basement windows and it took me a whole day and one roll of coil stock. An experienced window crew could have replaced and capped all those windows in half a day with half a roll of coil or less. Window capping is about the worst because there are alot of bends and like IHI said, there is a method to the installation. Simple fascia and frieze boar caps are simple.
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:32 PM   #19
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Grumps right on, even after years of being the grunt, bending for gramps, my very first job to bend/install on my own was just 3 replacement windows I had to cap...standard stuff. Even after watching (but not paying a great amount of attention for detail to what was involved all those years for actually installing it) it took me an hr a window and looking back they were not what I'd call a good capping job...it was on par with what many hacks can do. Even trying to teach novice helpers over the years is VERY trying on my patience since they screw up 3-5 times before they get it right and all I can think about is there's $10 in the garbage, oh, there's another $10 in the trash can. I look at it now and it's second nature and laugh at how hard it is for most people to grasp, but then i reminise...everything is backwards while your trying to think forward. And just wait for when you need to bend pieces with parallogram type pices due to old crap not being true and trying to keep all the meassruements marked at the right spot on the right end of the coil stock LOL!!!

You can take a day to work a buddy and get a quicker feel for it and move on, or spend countless pointless hours wasting all your time and alot of money trying to learn this on your own. your time is money...so invest it wisely
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Old 02-15-2006, 09:37 PM   #20
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Re: How To Use A Brake?


Your in luck. I dug down deep in the anals of my video collection and found the video that came with my brake. You are welcome to it. Just email me your address and I will send it to you. In the meantime I will look through the shop and see if the book that came with the brake is somewhere.

To answer your question about capping the windows. Start with the bottom and work your way to the top. That way you are sure to overlap the proper way.

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