Cedar Siding Estimate Help

SOSSW

We are a fairly new siding company (2 yrs old in june) and have done several vinyl siding jobs but have an opportunity to side a sizeable new construction home with cedar lap siding and are not sure what range to price just labor at. Is this a per square or per lineal foot pricing? Any help would be greatly appreciated.


Dan

Grumpy

Ever installed fibercement (hardie) The labor rate is about the same.

SOSSW

Grumpy,

Until this point, we have concentrated on vinyl siding for the exterior. We have estimated our vinyl siding jobs by the square. The material list for the cedar siding job we are looking at lists the siding by the linear foot. The job also lists all the trim and soffitt by the linear foot.

Bob
S.O.S. Siding & Windows, LLC

bob the builder

I haven't installed vinyl siding in years so it any time comparision would be by memory. With that said I would say it takes between 15-20% longer to install cedar by the sq. ft. The extra time it takes to caulk compared to installing j-channel. For corners it takes about the same time, many times no where to nail on 1 side. Materials are heavier and take longer to haul around in random lengths. Some installers mitre butt seams, either way it takes longer to measure to a stud. If cedar is prefinished you need to spot all of the nails.
I estimate siding by the sq. ft. and trim by the lineal ft.

Bob

vtgaetano

Caulking???/? I would get fired if there where any joints that needed caulking and I am working with wood. Bid all your siding by the sq. find out in YOUR AREA what the average price is. Vinyl, cedar and hardi plank are all different prices, wood being the most sq ft price. If your good, you can put any of it on about the same speed.

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TimNJ

Watch the details on the corners. Did an addition on a house years ago where the inside and outside corners were alternately lapped back and forth as the siding went up the wall instead of having corner boards. The first time I did it I was scratching my head until we got a system down. It was a real time waster. We ended up setting up two radial arm saws and set each one for the bevel and angle for each direction so we weren't constantly switching back and forth.

bob the builder

I'm assuming that you are just saying that you like to have tight joints and don't need a 1/2" bead to cover up bad cuts. I think your crazy if you think that vinyl installs at the same speed as cedar. Other things I didn't mention about that take more time. If cedar isn't acclimatized I stack material on spacers every layer off of the ground. I also caulk butt joints if cedar isn't prefinished. If it is prefinished you still need to touch up any cuts you make. Having to use a siding jig to get the desired reveal alone takes a little extra time. Around here 6" reveal is somewhat stand and vinyl covers 8", so that alone more pieces would need to be installed. All of these things add up to more install time...

Bob

willbone3

I am a sub in cincinnati ohio. we would get 150 square to install siding. the trim we would only get 1.00 foot worth at least 1.50 but we mostly install vinyl, we just finished a condo complex 1800 square charter oak siding, full wrap trim and soffit 6 inch gutters took 6 months.

Grumpy

You're serious!? All joints must be caulked as per good building practice IMO.

All butt joints are miter cut and sealed with a bead of caulk. I want to see a good bleed out when I am inspecting a job. Yes I want the joint to be tight but there must be a bead of caulk! Also at any trim to siding (horizontal to verticle) joints there must also be caulk. Caulk all joints period. It needs it!

SOSSW

Thank You to everyone for the input so far.

I have been watching this forum for a while now and it is amazing how much a person can learn just by watching the interaction between the experienced persons in any given field or topic.

The cedar siding for this job is already sealed on both sides. Will we need to seal the mitred ends each time a cut is made before the siding is attached to the home or are the boards attached to the house with the mitred ends matched up and then each joint is calked?

As far as the estimating is concerned, we are still trying to determine the going rate in this area. (Iowa)

Thanks again.

Bob

vtgaetano

Sorry Grumpy,

We don't use caulk on wood. Something that I learned a long time ago. Not the way we do it around here.

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vtgaetano

one more thing.......

Grumpy,
Take a look at the photo I have in the "carpentry gallery" titled mahogany siding, does it look like caulking would be "acceptable" on that job. I just don't feel it is good advice to tell someone that caulking and wood siding go together.......

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Glasshousebltr

There's a neat trick to cedar I think you'll like. Souround all your openings, corners and freeze with a thin strip of 5/4 cedar, 2 inches or so. Then cut your siding up tight to it. Install all your 3/4 trim over the strip and siding joint to make a sorta wood J channel. it makes a bit more work but it looks really nice. I flash under when I do it.

I don't think Grumps talking about pumping gaps. I also use caulk with wood, not to hide anything, just to seal things up.

Bob

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Bob

joasis

When I have to bid on something I am unsure about, and it does happen, I go back to the rule of pricing...labor should run a little more then the cost of materials, like a factor of 1.2 or 1.3 X materials. Others may say this doesn't work, but it has for me in the past, and may be something to consider. And then there is always the tried and true method of price it like you do vinyl, and next time, you will now how much more you need to make, so long as you make wages...

bob the builder

I would still price the labor as you do the vinyl and add 15%...

Bob

Sider' Brian

"I would still price the labor as you do the vinyl and add 15%..."

That sounds about right to me.

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IHI

Last addition we did with cedar I priced it at $150/sq to install. It was a very small addition though and we were able to order full length pieces for each side so we just had to cut around windows/doors.

Once you "switch gears" from what your used to and put a few panels of it up, it does go pretty good. I was nervious as hell since each board was $100/my cost since it was custom sized 10", measured 3-4 times and still puckered when the saw fired up

Or if you really wanted to cover your azz for the learnging experience, just price it out as time and material-that way you get paid for everything you do....just gotta be fair with the homie since initally ou'll be a lil slower since it's "new" to you, hard to penalize the homeowner when your trying something different...part of the process and next time you'll know exactly where to be price wise.

Love the cedar siding!! smells soo good and easy to work with.

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SOSSW

Hello all.

The material for this job is already on site and all we are doing is providing the labor. Since the material spec is listed in linear feet, we did some research to come up with a price to find out how much the material MAY have cost and went a little higher than the material cost.

We also estimated how much time and labor it will take to complete the job and multiplied this times our hourly rate.

We then came up with the total squares of wall space and feet of soffitt and came up with a price per square to install siding and price per foot to install soffitt.

To our surprise, all of these numbers were in the same neighborhood. We then came up with a happy medium between all of these numbers and presented our estimate. After a week or two, the homeowner (acting as general contractor) has offered us the job. We signed the contract last night.

We were talking to another contractor last night who happened to know the other bidders and bids on the job and it appears we were right in the ballpark.

A BIG THANK YOU to all that provided input on this matter.

Now to execute the install...