Any Good Alternatives To Capping Windows With Aluminum Coil Stock?

MJW

Re-read my post. I said the hacks here. Most of the wood they cover up is rotted already.

We also won't sell inserts. It's really not a new window, IMO.

buddy110

Define "good window". The quality os ANY replacement window has nothing to do with wrapping the outside.

buddy110

Simply not true. We replace about 1,000 units a year and less than 5% are rotted.

Framer53

I don't know about you Buddy, but if the sill is rotted, why not just cut it off and put some backer in gor the capping.

He must live in an area where people don't care.

buddy110

Nah, I'll just cover it up like the other hacks

Framer53

Buddy is a hacker!

MJW

A window with a nailing fin, not an insert. A new construction window. Just caulking in an insert is not window replacement, IMO.

It just bothers me when I go to a job and everything is just "covered up", if you know what I mean.

Yes, I've wrapped windows, but I don't like it, and it's usually a pricing thing. It's tough to get some people to pay for the cheap wrap. On top of it, it's still not "maintenance free" like everyone seems to want.

buddy110

So let me get this straight. ANY window with a nailing fin is better than say an OKna Starmark with TPKG, or a Marvin infinity?

MJW

If you are talking inserts......... As far as being water tight, yes! Definitely. Plus you get new insulation, new trim, new jambs, everything. Why stick a good window into an old opening? Then wrap it and call it good.....

Some call it good, but I don't.

buddy110

Ahhhh, but that's not what you said. You said " a good window" which has zero to do with whether it's NC or an insert. As far as water tight, If you trim the window correctly an insert is ever bit as water tight as a window with a nailing fin. I challenge you to find a better window than a properly installed Marvin infinity, Or Okna Starmark, both of which are inserts

MJW

A good window to me is not an insert, get it?

It's still an old opening with an old sill and old insulation (if there is any).

Sorry, I just don't believe an insert is really replacing much......but then again, when we do windows, we also do siding 99% of the time.

Exteriors123

I agree that you won't find new construction windows as good as okna starmark, infinty, soft-lite, even alside 3 pane.

Plus who would use the old insulation anyways, and if you're not dealing with vinyl on the outside, wouldn't using a nailing fin require a ton of extra labor?

buddy110

Believe me, I understand what your saying. However you still haven't addresed my challenge. Your more concerned with some insulation around the old window than the overall thermal performance of the opening. Sure, you can put a vinyl or wood DH DP and then you can address the small pockets between the jack stud and window jamb. However if you think that alone makes it a better window your dead wrong.

Take an Andersen 400 for example. Good window, right? Made from wood flour and resins with an overall U factor of .28 and AI of .10. Now compare that to the U .15 and ai .01 of the Okna starmark. Overall your NC window with insulation is half the perfromer. How is that a better window??

MJW

I'm not stuck on window brands and their "performance".

Keeping them dry, and sealed is more important (installation).

Most air leaks are around the window, not the window itself. Especially when dealing with a home over 30 years old. Sure, window seals leak, etc... but the main concern is putting in a new energy efficient window and correcting installation errors from the Contractors of the past.

I agree, a quality window is important, but the install (and NOT being an insert) is just as important or more so.


For your example, a "better window" is a new construction window. Like I said, caulking an insert into a hole is not full replacement if you ask me.


I really have a feeling that we may be talking about a few different things here without knowing it.

Exteriors123

Most of the heat loss is through the glass of a window. If you took a well installed starmark at .15 u factor vs a well installed new construction window at .35(just meeting energy star), and compared the BTU loss per hour....

The new construction window would lose roughly 131 Btu/hr, while the starmark would only lose 56 btu/hr.

A btu by the way is roughly equivalent to a lit matchstick. I based this on a mild northeastern winter day on a 10 square foot glass opening.

Throughout a month, the new construction window would lose almost 95,000 btu, while the starmark would only use 40,320.

Tom Struble

i agree with both, you can get a good insert install but im of the opinion
a total r&r is the smart way to go

Ive seen what looked like good installs of replacement ''sashes''[cause that's what they are]put into rotten window frames

most installers may replace a rotten sill but that usually does not address rotten sheathing or framing or why it rotted in the first place

i look for damaged wood before i recommend or agree to install vinyl inserts
if i find any i always recommend a full tear out

there's more to any window replacement then what caulk you use or trim selection

__________________
Tom

Tom Struble

and please do we have to go with who is or is not a hack

i don't think anyone who posted here is one or was called one

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Tom

buddy110

Nah, I know we're looking at this diferently. Both points are valdid. Inserts are just more common because of cost.

MJW

That's what I was getting at. Thanks Tom for a better explanation.

MJW

I'll agree with that 100%.