ApgarNJ

We finished this in may of 2006. It's currently being shown on a Fall House Tour this weekend. Since these pictures were taken, more landscaping has been added all around the house and patio. All the walls are dry laid, wasn't included as part of my Bid.

Before Addition


After


Alternate View

Cole

I like it, great job!

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Midtown Tulsa Remodeling

Bob Kovacs

Not that the house had much style to begin with, but the addition really didn't help it at all. There's just no style whatsoever to anything, leaving the shingle roof on the old house against the bright red metal on the addition was a really bad idea, and the windows look like they were selected based on what sizes were on sale at HD that week, rather than what was needed to make the elevations look right. Sorry to sound so harsh, but there's just nothing there worth talking about. Does the interior tell a better story (I hope)?

neolitic

Not to detract, but isn't flashing those knee braces a nightmare?
The metal roof is nice.

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ApgarNJ

well bob. sorry you think there is nothing to talk about. why did you bother even posting then?
these windows are not bought from HD and the sizes were carefully chosen by the architect. the look is maybe not for everyone but architects like to throw their own little ideas into the mix to show character. it wouldn't look good with all red roof. or all shingled roof. i like the way it came out. i didn't design it. i just built it. that is what i was showcasing, we did all new windows in the whole house, except the second floor of the original house. they are marvin windows and cost about 35,000. this is a custom design and you know how architects get. she wanted more than just a boring normal look. that's why the leaning wall is there. and that balacony which isn't your standard design.

i don't have many pics of the inside but will take more soon. i'm slowly gathering pics but it's hard to do after the people move in.

sorry you don't like it. you are the first person to really say they don't think it has no style. it's originally an old farm house. which has been modernized but still has the slight features of the old house.

i just wanted to show some of the work that i have done. I hope most of you like it. since Bob didn't. i'll go look for some of your work to see if it's perfect. this forum is for showing work we've done. not bashing design. the craftsmanship is what i pride myself on and what has given me the reputation I have to do quality work. Some of you would choke on what these people spent to renovate the whole first floor of this house and the addition. not even including the cost of those dry laid stone walls.

Thanks for the nice comment Cole. some people just dont' appreciate custom designs that are little out of the norm.


neo, no problem flashing those braces. they have blocking in the wall and are bolted from behind and from the face too with smaller fasteners. the braces themselves don't penetrate the wall. that whole balcony is cedar.

Bob Kovacs

Well, I'm glad that at least you weren't the designer- there's someone else to blame....lol. Of course he thinks it's "custom"- what else is he going to call it? I've seen true "custom" work (and built it- I'll see if I can get some pics posted on Monday when I get back to the office), and that's not it. I mean, for God's sake, in the last pic, there's a window on the second floor that has the fascia and soffit of the addition covering the window trim, and the gutter is in front of the glass. I know that you're probably going to tell me that it's an existing window that they didn't want to pay to move, but geez....that's just bad planning- they should have either narrowed the addition slightly, slid it forward, or paid to move the window.

And who told you that the house wouldn't "look good" with an all red roof? I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that the architect came up with that one....

I'm sure I would choke if I knew how much they paid for the project- and that's not a good thing. Again, not bashing your work- I'm sure the craftsmanship is great- but the architect needs to go back to school.

mahlere

not commenting on the design (other than it's not my taste) or the construction (looks good from my house)....however, this is a perfect example of why most small contractors are the worst people to deal with customers and run their business....we take things too personal.

I've learned that the more successful business have people who deal with the customers...people who don't take things personally...

Bob didn't say anything about your mad constructing skills...his comments were directed totally towards the design and look of the building.

yet, you took the comments very personally, to the point of "i'll go look for some of your work to see if it's perfect."

relax, take the comments for what they are worth. If you want to post a pic on a public forum and invite comments, deal with them all....good and bad.

And again, Bob's comments weren't even directed towards you in any way shape or form...

Oh..i agree with Bob...I personally don't like the design of the house...from the siding to the deck to the shape. But, that's just my opinion.

Tom R

Beautiful workmanship, Ap, helluvan improvement . . .

a2zhandi

I agree in part with Bob. The addition should have been bumped toward the front at least a foot, or the finished eve height should have been raised a few feet. I think it was a design flaw and the gutter was later added. I do like the barn house design though. The workmanship looks good from where I'm sitting/.

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BuiltByMAC

Not that I'm saying anything negative about your workmanship at all -

Is the siding complete on the wall with the little deck? I see lap siding on the entire house except from that 2nd story deck up to the gable. That part is just solid - stucco? I've not seen that before and am wondering the reason behind the change in siding materials.

By the way, forum members are not restricted to only saying good things about pictures posted here. If they see something that looks odd (say, a gutter system installed in front of a window), they are free to make comments on it.

You built what you were given plans to build, good job on that. However, once you post pics, people will comment on the design of the job as well. If you'd posted pics of the framing process, we could see how well you put things together.

Mac

ApgarNJ

I do tend to take things personally. even if you don't agree with the design, and i didn't like the placement of certain windows at the time but the architect is a women who likes to go against the grain sometimes and give something to talk about. like the first after pic, the little casement window is fine, but i wanted to center it below the upper window of the bedroom
bob, you are correct on the gutter./window. the architect didnt plan, and that is kinda hard to predict exactly when architects don't scale the whole project on the side of the house ahead of time, she knew the window would be close and at the time, the people spent enough money by the time the gutters were hung, that the window had to stay. my thought is that they are going to want me to replace all the remaining second floor windows soon, the homeowners are great people to work for. If you saw what this house looked like before, on the back, prior to the new foundation being put in, you'd know that this is much better than it was. the whole first floor and then the addition are all brand new. The design doesn't bother me that much but I wish they had put some colored trim up, and shutters on the windows. it's too plain for me but hey, i got paid and made good money so what difference does it make to me, as long as the client is happy.

mac, i do have pics of the framing process but i'm sure someone will say they do it differently than I do and I don't need or want to hear that.
I know it is framed correctly and to the specs. lots of lvls, I joists, and beams. Including an EXPOSED (painted red) steel I beam right inside near the leaning chicken coup style wall that you can see on the gable end picture.

i don't mind bob giving his opinion but I wish he had said something positive about the work itself and not just stating it has no style and there is nothing to talk about. I'm not a builder with 30 guys working for me, I do all that work myself with two other workers. the subs did their normal thing.
the siding is all hardie plank as well as the soffits and rakes and fascias. the trim o the corners and windows is miratech. i really like that more than azek. but azek is more popular because they advertise more.

I know that people are going to say good and bad, but I just don't like taking the heat for what some architect(who i work with alot and feeds me a lot of work) has designed. I was simply looking for comments on the before and the after. the house is definitely better off than it was prior to me getting there, they paid 450 for 5 acres and the house. and now it's appraised at 1.2 million on the same plot of land. it's about 3500-4000 sq ft. oh another contractor had done the attic renovation prior to me coming in. he did the two dormers, so that shingled roof was brand new. i don't mind the mixing of two roofs. that is alot of RED imo.
plus, the cost of that metal was a lot more than shingles and they didn't want to tear off the existing brand new roof(two layers, i know, i didn't do that either. lol)

I'll post some pics of the inside when I get a chance.

also,

the second floor wall at the gable near the balcony is all white stucco. as per the architects request. it breaks up the siding look. there is a lot of hardie plank on that house. wasn't fun doing that in the middle of winter.

I think they need to add some shutters to the windows but I'm not the one making the decisions there.

Cole

Feel free to post all the pictures of the project!

Its great to see other guys work!

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Midtown Tulsa Remodeling

Bob Kovacs

You're right- I should have said something positive about the work itself, but there's two problems with that:

1. You can't really "see" the work itself and the level of craftsmanship because they're such large-frame pictures- you can't see the detail. You can't see how tight the joints are, or how cleanly the different materials line up. Of course, everything being white doesn't help with that issue either.

2. The design being so "interesting" (see, I'm trying to be nice....lol), just draws your eye to things like that window/gutter issue, and detracts from the craftsmanship- you see something like that, and you just can't look beyond it.

As a suggestion, I wouldn't use any pics showing that window/gutter issue in your portfolio- some prospective client is bound to notice it, and if they even mention it, you've got to now explain how "well, the architect didn't measure the whole house, and nobody noticed it until the gutter went on" scenario. That would be the last thing I'd want to hear, as IMO as a potential client, that's something that should have been seen and addressed much earlier. Even worse would be if the potential client saw it and didn't mention it, and dismissed you as their contractor because they didn't even get to hear the reasoning behind the situation- they just said "I'm not having this guy work on my house if that's the kind of stuff he lets happen".

When you show pics of that project in your portfolio, be sure to mention something along the lines of "this is a project that was designed by a local architect who included some unique features meant to really set the project apart". Don't go into "well, it's not really my style- I just build 'em" or anything, or sound defensive, but make sure they understand the process you went through.

If you've got some close-ups of that deck, I'd really like to see them- the bracing system looks pretty unique, and I'd like to see how it was all tied together.

Again- didn't mean to knock the project's execution, I just still can't get past the overall look of the house - especially now that you told me it appraised for $1.2 million (but then again, appraisals don't normally take "style" into account, obviously....lol).

dkillianjr

Geez everybodys so critical around here. I like it ApgarNJ, I like that balconey, I'm gonna assume thats stucco on the second floor, thats a cool touch too. Like you said the house has the old style with the new. Looks like good craftsmanship to me


Dave

nywoodwizard

Overall i think it looks real good. I think the transition from siding to the stucco looks really good. The red roof looks spicy ! i like it. The deck looks nice. It does look a little plain on the front of the house, maybe a few shutters would give it the punch it needs. I'm sure a little landscaping won't hurt either. The window thing is not the end of the world but after the framing was completed and discovered i would of moved it over a bit. Sometimes new window placement is not dictated by the symmetrics of the exterior, The architect may have chosen there position to work better for the interior design. I know lots of people that want there windows place in certain positions for interior design reasons,not exterior. Nice job keep up the good work.

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neolitic

Sure would like to see her "details" sheet for that balcony, but I'm sure she'd get all bunched up over copyrights and all.
It sure is pretty, but it's a "girl thing" for sure. They like to get their "Juliet" moment
It always seems like so much work for something you can't really stretch out on.
I'm sure it was a lot of work! From what I can see you did a great job on it.

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ApgarNJ

I can take some closeups up the balcony. it wasn't terribly hard to build, but it still took two days to get completely done.

it's way to small. i'll give that to you guys but it's really just for them to walk out and have a cup of coffee in the morning or whatnot. but i would designed it bigger to at least put two chairs on. a job coming up in the spring has an all cedar balcony which will have the same 45 degree braces back but be 5' out and 9' wide.

as far as the gutter window goes. it was an existing window. and to tell you the truth, that is the tightest job, when it comes down to an inch or less of error getting everything to line up perfectly. every single 1/2" mattered no matter where you went in this project. so for that to be the only spot that is kinda of a problem which could be addressed by replacing that old anderson window with a narrower one or moving it slightly. the main house is balloon framed, so we blocked it half way and had blown in insulation put in from the outside along the existing second floor which wasn't gutted to the studs like the whole first floor was.

oh, as far as details on the balcony, nothing was even in the construction docs on how to build that. i went off some simple sketches she made up on paper. inspector never even really looked at it. lol

ApgarNJ

here is one more angle of the finished job prior to the landscaping being installed, which looks really good now.
and some framing pics. i'm pretty picky with framing when it comes to making it right and joints tight. maybe because i'm the guy putting windows in and trimming them later on too. rather than hiring some framer who could care less what happens after he leaves the job. or how great things line up.
(not all framers, but some are like that)

A W Smith

Nice Job, Its a nice farmhouse without all the gingerbread that seems to be overdone lately. Looks like she was trying to keep it clean and simple. I miss the front entry portico to the far left in the before photo. Maybe in her eyes it would have drawn attention away from the entire front elevation. On the gutter problem she should have spotted that when she did that elevation unless she placed the existing window in the wrong location with her preliminary measurements. if she did she owes it to the client to pay for the relocation of that window.

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BuiltByMAC

Hey guy,

What order did you stand the walls with that angled wall bump out? Just looking at it trying to figure out which would be the easiest way to support an angled wall...

(By the way, I like the framing pics!)

Mac