Question On RTA Cabinets And A Good Counter Top

Project53

I'm looking to rehab some older construction homes. The kitchen cabs are junk and need to be redone. There is a small profit margine on these homes so I'm looking at RTA cabinets. The kitchens are small and only have at the most 12 cabs to be replaced. I'd rather put in REAL wood then the junk from HD. I figure it's worth my time to spend the 4 hours or so to put them together(i intend to glue them also, not just use the screw clamp crap). Cabinets from like..instockkithens.com...
Has anybody used these? or another company that they feel has a good product? Whats the quality of the finish,wood?
They have to look good! I'm going with the WOW factor..like it's real wood to sell the place.

Has anybody used or even seen these countertops from Wilsonart HD?
They look great on the website...but real life is another story.
It's just a laminate counter top..but it's supposed to look like stone.
Then of course what is the pricing...LOL

Project53

WOW..nobody has an opinon on this?????
I went into one house that the guy I know for a fact used the RTA cabs in the Kitchen. I saw the boxes in the garage before I went in.
I don't know where he got them from, but was listed as China..at least on the box.
The quality was great..and as soon as you opened the door on the cabs....real wood...looked great...infact thats what sold the house in 1 weekend.
To be honest it looked and felt twice as good as most cabs...at 3 time the price.
For the X amount of hours it would take me to put them together..I think it's well worth the effort for a meduim priced house.....to save 1500-2500.
The counter tops on the other hand, I have no clue. I have to take a road trip, to the nearest dealer..to take a look at this Wilsonart stuff.

keepitstraight

had ho's buy rta's but they never fit well. if they work, that's cool. your assembly time is going to offset price savings but should still give you some clear savings.

personally i hate to get anything from china as 60% of their corporations are owned by their army and the resta re basically owned by their navy. we need to make something here w/o the ceo's and shareholders raiding all the income. then they say americans aren't competitive. (no duh if all the profits are handed out and the factory falls apart or gets dated and inefficient)

sorry.

paulibra79

There are now some manufacturer making pretty good RTA cabints in both North and South China. Solid wood door, plywood box, well finished with AC stain, easy to assemble. It's quite different from what you guys thought before.

keepitstraight, you are wrong. "60% of their corporations are owned by their army and the resta re basically owned by their navy"---well, that's absurd fancy. As a matter of fact, China governament forbid any army organization run any commercial items.

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JamesDibben

We have installed a hand full of RTA (we have always called them Knock Down) cabinet brands. I can't believe the quality curve in that industry.

I sent in an email to one of my customers who distributes the best one I've ever seen. When she gets back to me I'll post it here.

There is one company out there called "Integrity" I believe, and those things are complete crap. In my opinion you are best to just check the quality of the machining and materials used. Some of those places use a 1/4 ply wood for the sides and they warp real bad.

Just be sure when you assemble them to make sure they feel sturdy. You may need to add some of your own supports. One issue we have especially noticed is the toe kick on the 36-48 inch cabinets. They tend to bow in the middle and when the floor gets laid down many times the bend is made permanent. Putting a runner in the center under the cabinet is important.

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paulibra79

James, 1/4 inch plywood side panel just sounds unbelievable. In our case, 1/2 ply wood is usual, sometimes 5/8, and 3/4 apply to frameless one. That's a interesting point about the bended toe kick on the 36-48 inch cabinets. Though I have not heard similar claim from my customers, I'll talk to my factory guy and ask them pay attention to this.

I have no idea what is "runner in the center", could you show me a picture?

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JamesDibben

Yeah, I'll get a pic when I check the mail in a bit. I have been around custom cabinets all my life and run a company that installs pre-finished cabinets. I'll stop by my dad's shop and shoot a pic of the bottom of a custom cabinet.

Many of these RTA cabinets just have a metal bracket to attach to the middle of the back of the toe kick for support. That is woefully inadequate. Some type of wood brace installed behind the toe kick is important. If you turn the cabinet upside down and look at the bottom then the runner will create a "T".

Here is a brand of RTA that I have been VERY impressed with.

http://www.riverruncabinetry.com/index.php

It's not a quick assemble and therefore can still end up being out of someone's budget. Many of the sheet pieces have pocket screw holes which makes for a much stronger assembled cabinet.

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Jimmy Cabinet

Thanks for providing the link to River Run Cabinetry. I thought I knew them all but never heard of them. I was ignoring all the revived threads that Paul opened today that are nearing some 75 years old at this point. But your good impression of an RTA caught my attention James.

Imagine that.......an American brand RTA. I read and reread the specifications on the product and I too am impressed. I may even look into this one further.

I also don't know what you mean under or behind the toe kick except yes they do need an additional support. I don't have to worry about that though since I would never stoop so low as to put that foreign junk into my customers homes. My health and my customers health are much too important to me and my morals.

Again....thanks for that link.

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JamesDibben

Glad I can help out another cabinet guy!

Attached is a pic of a vanity cabinet with 'runners' for support.

Assembling River Run Cabinetry isn't for the inexperienced (okay none of it is). To assemble these correctly you will need some pipe clamps and keep your tube of clear adhesive silicone close. Once you are done they are surprisingly sturdy and the finish is as good as any factory built box.

They still aren't the price point that a full Chinese cabinet can drop to but they are still less expensive than factory built even with the assembly time.

We put these in a higher end home and the customer was VERY satisfied.

I'm not totally down on RTA. They are better suited for lower end multi family, preferably in a 3rd world country.

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Jimmy Cabinet

Do you want to know what stopped me short? The fact that these RTAs are FRAMED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Where ya going to find an RTA with a face frame?!?!?!?!?!?!

As I have always said. In Europe they dislike our framed style but here in the west we really do not like frameless. For those who want to shoot me, I mean the vast majority do not like frameless.

So maybe I didn't understand. You are putting those runners under or it comes that way? Even some of the most costly fully assembled boxes do not have supports under the floor like that but most all have some sort of a triangle shaped block or 2 or 2 glued behind the toe kick which is really the only support needed. Except when the big fat Plumbers stand inside the sink bases or the granite guys cut the sink cutout and let the granite slab come crashing down thereby demolishing the sink base floor......

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JamesDibben

The only RTA cabinets I've seen were framed.

The picture is of custom cabinets my dad builds. On the RTA cabinets we've assembled (not River Run) we had to add those pieces to keep the toe kick from bending.

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UpNorth

Where ya going to find an RTA with a face frame?!?!?!?!?!?!

Well, there is that little company called Conestoga.

MSLiechty

maybe I'm just purist. but will only use 3/4" material. the cost savings not that great compared to the added strength, longevity in my book.

ML

Framer53

I used RTA cabinets in my house and have no complaints.

I glued them together as well as used the enclosed hardware. Been in 2 years now and no complaints.

I also used granite for the counter top, 27 lineal feet.