My first official deck - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

RobertCDF · 11-14-2005, 12:18 AM

This was the first deck I did all on my own let me know what you think. I underbid it real bad I think I made like $10.00 hour or less on it

oh well you live and learn. Got the neighbors deck though so I guess it all worked out. I will post some newer ones one of these days.

mdshunk · 11-14-2005, 12:25 AM

Good looking deck.

The railings appear low, and the ballusters seem too far apart, but my eyeball hasn't been calibrated in a while.

Better money on the next ones. In any business, you need to screw up a few bids to get your estimating on track. It also helps you build a portfolio of references.

RobertCDF · 11-14-2005, 12:28 AM

Its all to code at least around here 36" high rails with less than 4" baluster gap it is a two tier so it looks like the rail is lower, that and I had to resize and crop it to get it small enough to post.

Woodcrafter74 · 11-14-2005, 08:33 AM

Nice job, especially for the first one.

My first one was a basic 16' x 20' only two feet off the ground, so nothing complicated at all--but I did profit about 4x what you did. I know, estimating gets more complex when there are angles, heights and stairs.
It looks like you had to attach and flash the ledger to a stucco house? Was that difficult? I still haven't done a stucco house yet.

P.s. I like your new logo.

Tom R · 11-14-2005, 05:38 PM

Rob, - - that is one beautiful job you did, - - one thing I usually do to greatly enhance the look (as long as the customer's willing to pay some extra), - - is to add both lower and upper horizontal rails on the 'outside' of the rail systems too, - - in other words, - - 'sandwich' your balusters so both the inside and the outside of the deck have a finished look.

ElmForest · 11-14-2005, 06:18 PM

Rob, where are you located? Depth/type of support posts? Type of decking/fastners? How did you attach to house? How soon was deck painted/stained? Pop quiz, eh?
I'd take lots of pics from different angles to show to new customers. Try to get one with homeowners smiling.

RobertCDF · 11-14-2005, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Woodcrafter74 It looks like you had to attach and flash the ledger to a stucco house? Was that difficult? I still haven't done a stucco house yet.

I lagged it the way we used to at my old job, and caulked the crap out of it I bet all the painters would have loved to see all that caulk

that was over a year ago and no call backs from the customer for water so I guess it worked so far. The logo I just made yesterday on a boring sunday afternoon I am glad you like it.

Quote:

Tom R Rob, - - that is one beautiful job you did, - - one thing I usually do to greatly enhance the look (as long as the customer's willing to pay some extra), - - is to add both lower and upper horizontal rails on the 'outside' of the rail systems too, - - in other words, - - 'sandwich' your balusters so both the inside and the outside of the deck have a finished look.

I see what you are saying I will keep that in mind, all of my recent customers have been using aluminum balusters sees to have realy taken off here I dont know when I will get a chance to do a regular rail again.

Quote:

ElmForest Rob, where are you located? Depth/type of support posts? Type of decking/fastners? How did you attach to house? How soon was deck painted/stained? Pop quiz, eh?
I'd take lots of pics from different angles to show to new customers. Try to get one with homeowners smiling.

Located in Colorado Springs, 30" deep piers ranging in diameter from 8" - 20" it is Correct Deck compsite with a hidden fastener clip system installed @ a 45 degree angle. I lagged to the house 2 3/8"x5.5" @ 12" o.c. and caulked the crap out of the top. I will post some more pics of this one in a few minutes (I have to eat dinner my wife is calling and getting mad) and maybe some of my newer ones too.

RobertCDF · 11-14-2005, 10:31 PM

another picture of the same deck

Glasshousebltr · 11-15-2005, 08:06 AM

Looks good Robert. How do you like composite? I'd use it every time if it wasn't so stinking expensive.

Bob

Woodcrafter74 · 11-15-2005, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom R

...one thing I usually do to greatly enhance the look (as long as the customer's willing to pay some extra), - - is to add both lower and upper horizontal rails on the 'outside' of the rail systems too, - - in other words, - - 'sandwich' your balusters so both the inside and the outside of the deck have a finished look.

Tom,
I just did a deck where I "sandwiched" the balusters like you suggested, it gives a nice look. The concern I had was that the homeowner wanted to make sure the balusters didn't spin. My solution was to put one screw in from the top and bottom and then shoot a few 2 1/2" 16ga nails next to the screws to keep the balusters from spinning. I'm not real comfortable that the 16 gauge nails will hold up long term.

I used a Cap rail, top rail and bottom rail--all laid flat. I know one way to take care of it is to have a support piece run on edge under then top rail so the balusters get screwed in from the side, but short of that, I couldn't think of any other options.

Woodcrafter74 · 11-15-2005, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobertCDF

it is Correct Deck compsite with a hidden fastener clip system installed @ a 45 degree angle.

I just got some samples from Correct Deck, do you have a preference for this brand versus some of the other composites--like Trex or Timbertech. How does it compare in price to the others, I haven't gotten a price list yet.

Thanks!

RobertCDF · 11-15-2005, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Glasshousebltr
Looks good Robert. How do you like composite? I'd use it every time if it wasn't so stinking expensive.

Bob

Bob, I try to sell it to eveyone of my customers I tell them that they will be much happier with it. Most of my decks are composite especialy when someone sees thier neighbors deck they always want to one up them. works out great for me

Quote:

Woodcrafter74
I just got some samples from Correct Deck, do you have a preference for this brand versus some of the other composites--like Trex or Timbertech. How does it compare in price to the others, I haven't gotten a price list yet.

Thanks!

Around here they price about the same as the other composites (weatherbest, trex, timbertech) But I think they are a much better, stronger product. A real pain to work with I kind of hate it but it is sturdy and looks good when done. As far as preference I only recomend this product. I think weatherbest is weak and marrs easy, I think trex fades horribly ( I have seen brown turn light gray) timbertech I nice too but I think it marks kind of easy too. But timbertech would probly be my second choice.

11-15-2005, 09:50 AM

I make a point of it to steer my customers away from correctdeck, reasons:
They sent me 3 of their sample/sales kits, so I was noticing variations in width of up to 1/4" from one piece to the next, hollow newel posts (won't look to nice when attached to rim), and their decorative rail attatchment clip is just plain piss poor. The only thing correctdeck has going for it is that it is already set up to use "correct-ty". I use Trex and timbertech and have no complaints myself or from my customers, personally I would chose to work with trex, but that's just my opinion. Robert, nice job, good attention to detail

just a friendly critique, The interaction of elevation change and the accute angle that is formed all converging on the edge of the stairs is somewhat of a design and safety hiccup, but otherwise keep pushing the quality work

RobertCDF · 11-15-2005, 10:30 AM

Quote:

cdac
I make a point of it to steer my customers away from correctdeck, reasons:
They sent me 3 of their sample/sales kits, so I was noticing variations in width of up to 1/4" from one piece to the next, hollow newel posts (won't look to nice when attached to rim), and their decorative rail attatchment clip is just plain piss poor. The only thing correctdeck has going for it is that it is already set up to use "correct-ty". I use Trex and timbertech and have no complaints myself or from my customers, personally I would chose to work with trex, but that's just my opinion. Robert, nice job, good attention to detail just a friendly critique, The interaction of elevation change and the accute angle that is formed all converging on the edge of the stairs is somewhat of a design and safety hiccup, but otherwise keep pushing the quality work

I have never had an issue with width varriations and I have done 7 Correct Decks now. I dont use composite posts at all I use 4x4 wood posts and wrap them with fascia, much stronger than any composite post could be and I rarley use the rails style or clips that any of them make does not fit in around here. Everyone like the traditional 2x4's on edge and 5/4x6 top cap. I think the rail caps most of the composite manufacturs make are stupid, I like a rail I can set stuff on top of like a bottle of beer

I have used trex 3 times and timbertech 1 time and weartherbest 1 time, around here we are at about 7,000 ft above sea level, the sun is intense and it beats stuff up after seeing the trex turn from brown to gray in a very short time I decided against them. The timbertech I did the guy asked me about a few scratches from his table I told him it was the nature of the product and it would all fade to match before long. Same with the weatherbest and thier "wood grain" fades away in a year. Maybe I am just to picky, I want it to look the same in 10 years as the day I put it in. As far as design, homeowners did the design and really wanted it that way so I just build it.

RobertCDF · 11-15-2005, 10:35 AM

I think the reason for the step down was just to lower the rails another 7" to not get in the way of the view from the main part of the deck I had some other ideas for design but they really like the one they came up with. I figured they knew best what they wanted so I built their design.

Mike Finley · 11-15-2005, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobertCDF

Maybe I am just to picky, I want it to look the same in 10 years as the day I put it in.

Robert, unless you have some secret CorrectDeck available to you, that stuff fades too. I don't know of any composite decking that doesn't fade, especially out here, the UV is a bitch.

What are you paying per linear ft for CorrectDeck, I'm betting with the cost of the fasteners added in you're approaching the price of Ipe. Ipe is a great wood for Colorado, ever used it?

RobertCDF · 11-15-2005, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Mike Finley
Robert, unless you have some secret CorrectDeck available to you, that stuff fades too. I don't know of any composite decking that doesn't fade, especially out here, the UV is a bitch.

What are you paying per linear ft for CorrectDeck, I'm betting with the cost of the fasteners added in you're approaching the price of Ipe. Ipe is a great wood for Colorado, ever used it?

Mike, True correct deck does fade but it seems to fade less than most. I have seen their mahogany color after it had been out 1 1/2 yrs and it did not fade much.
I have never used ipe I have looked at it but not had a customer want it yet. Correct me if I am wrong but you have to stain ipe every year too? I am paying about $2.30 LF for the decking and am just switching over to GRK stainless steel star drive trim head screws. I have been using the coated ones but I think it would be better to go to the SS.

Mike Finley · 11-15-2005, 12:27 PM

Damn, the last time I bought Ipe it was $1.39 linear foot for 1x6, which is strong enough to apply over 24 IOC framing if you wanted to.

Yes, you should treat any deck made of wood in Colorado once a year. Is that more maintenance then a composite product? Yes, but after 5 years the Ipe looks identical to the day it was installed, the composite, looks 5 years old.

When I was doing decks I felt it my job to educate customers to the pros and cons of composite. As long as they knew that "maintenance free" doesn't exist in Colorado and the best they would ever do was "reduced maintenance" +"slowly degrading esthetic's" then the choice was theirs to make.

I upsold everybody who asked about composite to Ipe. Once I gave them a solution to their maintenance which is using Penofin products to re-coat they were sold on the investment, plus they got real wood. (Plus it was a no brainer when I showed them a 6 year old piece of Trex next to a brand new piece!) Everybody wants the look of real wood anyways. Penofin requires them to either set aside a few hours once a year to protect their deck and return it to brand new condition or to just pay somebody $200-$300 to do it for them.

I'm not trying to convince you to switch what you are doing or that composite is wrong or anything else, just passing some information and exchanging experiences back and forth between two deck builders.

RobertCDF · 11-15-2005, 01:02 PM

Boy mike 10:30?? to cold to work for you too?

I am just sitting around today maybe I am just a wuss oh wait I remember one of the reasons I started my own company... I dont have to work in freezing weather

$1.39 lf for ipe sounds real good what species was it? I had priced Tigerwood when I first started in case someone asked it was I think $1.99LF but that stuff is really nice I would like to do one I am sure I will get someone soon enough. I always tell people there is no such thing as a maintenance free deck, but low maintenance involves washing it down, a couple of times a year with a composite deck wash solution.

11-15-2005, 01:07 PM

http://www.ipedepot.com/home.htm