Fridays Riddle Of The Day

480sparky

If you all want to get technical, keep in mind the direction the bullet is fired will impact any insignicant difference between the two bullets hitting the ground.

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jtpro

Even he points out variables and says it depends.

In the OP's case he's talking rifles.

Different calibers,grains,velocities. etc

mics_54

unknown given the data...the question wasn't which falls farther in a given period of time....it doesnt list variables or bullet type or temprature or humidity...that being said..neglecting the variables and anomolies the two bullets fall the same distance in the same period of time.

480sparky

For all intents and purposes, they hit the ground at the same time. Any difference probably could not be seen or heard by a person, but would be able to be calculated mathematically.

The OP's question is usually regarged as a hypothetical situation: The earth were perfectly spherical, with no atmosphere, and the ability to time the release of the dropped bullt with the exact time the fired bullet leaves the end of the barrel (obviously, if you dropped the one bullet at the same time you fired the other round, the results would be skewed as the fired round would have to travel to the end of the barrel before gravity could begin to affect it's downward travel while the dropped bullet is free-falling until then).

There's other minor details Cecil is missing. One is the assumption of a perfectly horizontal barrel, and that the round fired from it is also perfectly horizontal in travel the instant it exits the barrel. Any gun owner will tell you they wish they could own such a firearm. Bullets have a tendency to not travel exactly where you aim for. The fired round may be traveling slightly upwards, or downwards, in which case the diffence between the two would be obvious.

And yes, with larger calbers, larger charges, etc., the fired bullet will travel down the curvature of the earth and land slightly behind the dropped bullet. Of couse, as Newton's Law of Gravitation states, it doesn't necessarily have to be another bullet. It could be a penny, a pocket knife, or a Nimitz-class aircraft carrier. They fall at the same rate.

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ScipioAfricanus

O.K. I screwed the pooch in part of my last post but the fact remains that the bullet fired horizontally FOLLOWS the curvature of the Earth AS it is dropping. It does not tail away from the surface by going "straight". That is because gravity acts on it at all places equally from the center of the earth at equal distances.

Andy.

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jtpro

No disrespect to you but you pointed to Cecil as a reference .

Trust me if I was schooled in physics I would be on a Quantum board discussing time travel or something.


And no disrespect to sawdaddy he meant this as a fun question but here on CT as you can see in other posts NO ONE answers a “generic” question without ALL parameters set.

So if we add these to the set parameters:


- there is no wind


- air resistance (and the shape of the bullet) will be ignored


Then yes the following ( from someone OBVIOUSLY WAY smarter than me)applies and they hit the ground at the same time.


"Because we are ignoring air resistance, (and tumbling of the bullet), the speed remains constant until the bullet reaches the ground.

Here's the principle you need to understand:

The horizontal motion of the bullet is completely independent of the vertical motion.

This means that the bullet starts to fall as soon as it leaves the barrel, and it will fall with the same acceleration as a bullet held in the hand and dropped.

It doesn't matter how fast or slow the bullet is moving horizontally ... the bullet will fall to the ground at the same acceleration as a bullet dropped from your hand.

So to calculate how long it will take the fired bullet to hit the ground, we need only calculate the time for a bullet to fall to the ground from the same height as the rifle barrel.

Here's a diagram to illustrate what we mean:



Whether the bullet has a low velocity or a high velocity will determine how far it gets before it hits the ground. But notice that for all three speeds illustrated above, the bullet always hits the ground at the same time as the bullet that is merely dropped.

The bullet's path is also clearly parabolic. This is because, while the bullet's forward velocity is constant (there is no pushing force acting on it after it leaves the barrel), it is accelerating downwards under the force of gravity. The distance it falls increases with every fraction of a second that passes."

480sparky

No need to apologize as no offence is taken. I enjoy a good technical debate.

I agree, and we're on the same page here. However, the faster the fired round travels, it will take longer to fall. Assuming a vacccum, of course. Image the bullet is fired just short of orbital velocity. And by 'just short', I mean 99.99% of OV. I think it will slowly spiral down to the ground. The closer to OV it gets, the longer it will take. Continue to increase the velocity and you will eventually shoot yourself in the ass...... although it will be an hour and a half later.

Of course, no firearm is capable of firing a round even remotely close to this speed. Although I do believe it is possible with experimental 'rail' guns. However, by the time a round reaches that speed, friction with the air will cause it to burn up rendering the question moot.

Another variable that has not been brought up is the possibility of the fired round encountering something airborne in it's path. Something as simple as a flying bug that just happens to be in the path of the round can affect it's trajectory.

I hate to say this, but you need to load your own rounds or switch brands. You have a serious problem with the quality of shells you're firing there. Not to mention they're all missing most of the powder. I'd estimate the best range you have on that rifle is 10 yards.

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Site : the area or exact plot of ground on which anything is, has been, or is to be located.
Sight : The power or faculty of seeing; perception of objects by use of the eyes; vision.
Cite : To mention in support, proof, or confirmation; refer to as an example.

Cdat

Oh, we disregard reality and have a fantasy session? Well, then, anything is possible, no?

jtpro

Considering their test was 5' high as an example ,yeah I think I could through the bullet farther than the rifle in their diagram.

SC sawdaddy

This thread has taken about the same route as Fridays discussion. Needless to say it wasn't one of our most productive days.

jkfox624

Oddly enough you can all get your answer next wed on Mythbuster's.