Client Collaboration/project Management Software

kevins9999

Hi everyone,

I'd like to find out if anyone is using any of the web-based client/project management solutions. I've looked at every one and I think they're all too expensive and too restrictive. I'd like something that has internal messaging, photo sharing (big plus... client sends job photos to their friends in a branded email), milestone tracking, punch list tracking, change order tracking w/ up-to-date project cost (including change orders.)

Here are the systems I've evaluated and my opinions:

BuilderTrend - Has most of the above requested features, but geared mostly to custom homebuilders, could be adapted to remodelers. Insanely expensive. I think it's $1200 to set up and then up to $5500/year depending on how many projects you have.

Co-Construct - doesn't have the photo sharing (which sounds like it could be an amazing marketing opportunity), very strict structure that can't be modified (eg. milestones is only a list, can't be shown as a calendar or gantt chart). Similarly priced to BuilderTrend, but a little less expensive.

Procore - Very complicated structure, although they seem to be toning it down so it's a little easier to use. They have most of the features, except the photo sharing (they all have on line photos - it's the ability to send the photos to friends in a branded email that's very interesting...) I think they price per project and charge a flat yearly fee. It's also in the $2K - $3K per year range. Procore is also centered around Microsoft Project. If you don't use MS project then it's very difficult to deal with.

BuildLinks - Similar to BuilderTrend, but designed almost specifically for custom home builders. They have a selection system that you need a PhD to figure out. Priced in the $2k - 3k per year range.

I've also looked at all of the generic offerings - like Basecamp, which could possibly work, but I don't see any way to accomplish the photo sharing. I'd like to try to keep everything under one roof - so I don't want to, for example, use Basecamp for project management and then use Flickr for photo sharing.

I'd love to hear everyone's opinion/experience with any of these systems - or any better alternatives!

Thanks in advance,

Kevin

rbsremodeling

Why are they two expensive??

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kevins9999

I guess you could replace "too expensive" with "more than I want to pay..." I think the business models of the contractor-specific companies that I outlined above is to offer one-on-one customer service and training to contractors, subs and clients. That's fine, but I think it's a little more than I'm looking for.

I'm approaching this from a marketing perspective, to offer:

a.) something that no one else in my area is offering
b.) an extension of our excellent customer service on the web, so clients feel connected to the project
c.) an easy way for clients to share our work with their friends, thereby spreading our identity and examples of our work through word-of-mouth

I think that the concept of social networking is something that all businesses can benefit from. Of course, I'm not expecting a Facebook-style application for business for free, but I can't justify spending $3k plus per year on a component of marketing.

So, I'm looking for other systems or ideas, should they exist, and people's experience with them.

rbsremodeling

Check out this software

http://www.smartcontractor.com/

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Ohiobuilder

I have experience with Buildlinks and found it was not for me. I think they are all set up to cater to the production builders as opposed to the custom builders.

The big benefit for me would have been the selections. Communication could be handled thru email or text messaging and photos could be handled thru the same or Picasa. With a custom builder or any contractor for that matter today there are so many options and there will be a lot of data entry in managing anyone of those sites.

I think they would be a huge plus for any contractor but I would hope you have a staff to enter the data.

PMI

Hi Kevin,
The problem that you will have is that many of your sub-contractors need some form of automation in order for collaboration to work, and many of them will simply not be able to afford to do so. And others may not be able to catch on. I am testing collaboration features with www.MyOnlineToolbox.com right now and have more than 400 active jobs. I send out a RFQ (Request for Quotation) to one or more subs and then accept/reject the bids. I then take these bids and incorporate them into my work orders and send them back out as Jobs to the subs. The subs that are also users of Toolbox have the jobs automatically inserted into their database (kind of like passing a meeting back and forth in Outlook with the details changing). We have bumped into some challenges that the company is working around. Care to join the testing community? Let me know.
Phil

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Phil Tonks
For all your Remodeling & Home Improvement needs in South Florida visit www.pmi1call.com

rbsremodeling

Phil I think tool box is a excellent program. I will be honest and tell you I chose another program for my business because I think it is a better fit. I do how ever think my plumbers, electrician, hvac, drywall and handyman business can use your program with a few tweaks.

I will sign up for a membership and shoot whoever it helps my ideas.

Why am I posting this offer because I see the benefits of your software and think I am a bit more computer savvy and would be helpful to be able to help my subs come on board with the software, if I can explain the software and processes to them.

Second since it would not be my main software I can try any modifications or ideas you/they have with out affecting my daily routine let me know.

Just an offer hope they take me up on it

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kevins9999

I feel the same way. Most of these contractor-specific packages are marketed towards medium-large size production builders. Interestingly, many of those companies are suffering from the building slow-down, so now they're re-packaging the same software to remodelers and custom builders.

Thanks for the input and offer, Phil. I checked out MyOnlineToolbox the other day. It looks like a great organizational tool (especially if you have over 400 jobs at the same time!) We have 6-10 jobs going at the same time and have a pretty good estimate/invoicing/billing workflow set up in Quickbooks Contractor Edition.

I guess I'm really looking for more communication-based collaboration. I've come to the realization that most customers don't understand a Gantt chart, but they love to email (and call) with questions. I need something that's going to centralize communications and basic milestones and tasks.

Contrary to what I posted above, I'm actually going to begin experimenting with Basecamp. I'm going to use smugmug for a photo gallery. They allow you to customize and brand the gallery page. They also let you email photos from the field right into a gallery.

I also created a simple Google Spreadsheet that will mirror our job estimate in Quickbooks. Everytime a customer adds something to a job, it gets added to the Job Estimate, then subsequently will be added to the google spreadsheet. The cool thing about Google Spreadsheets is that they will automatically publish themselves to the internet with a unique key id, so I can use an HTML IFRAME in Basecamp to show a live, updated project total to the customer right on the homepage.

Now the trick is to see how much work is involved in keeping all of this updated. I will let everyone know how this progresses...or if I find anything else that works better.

rbsremodeling

What about google docs???

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kevins9999

Google Docs is great for sharing and collaborating on documents. I suppose you could use the Google Sites component to make simple access-controlled website, but it's not really designed for collaborating with clients.

I'm using a component of Google Docs - Google Spreadsheets for a live running project total, but I'm posting it in an IFRAME inside of Basecamp.

PMI

Hi RBS,
I talked with the MyOnlineToolbox guys while they were traveling. They asked for me to make contact with you outside this public forum. I am waiting for their written communication and will forward it to you directly. They indicated they would get back to me by early next week. Check in with you then.
Phil

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Phil Tonks
For all your Remodeling & Home Improvement needs in South Florida visit www.pmi1call.com

rbsremodeling

Sounds like a plan you can contact me rory@rbsremodeling.com

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Magic Hammer

Hi Kevin,

Check this post out.
http://www.contractortalk.com/f108/contruction-software-option-44508/
You may want to talk to Toni.

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Skye Builders, inc.
Decks,Sunrooms,Windows and Siding
www.skyebuilders.com

kevins9999

Thanks for the link, Magic. I dabble in asp.net and visual basic.net myself, and started writing something. That was about a year ago. We're really busy now (which is good...) but I'm stuck in the catch-22 of needing a system and not having the time to write it.

Having said that, and because my self-diagnosed OCD won't let me go to bed until this is solved... here's where I am in all of this.

Basecamp has really good messaging and file storage, and really lousy milestone and task management. But, it's a good framework to hold the basis of this system. I can add other components from the web as I find them.

I'm going to use smugmug to create user galleries for each client project. Smugmug lets you brand the gallery page completely with your own logo and code... so it's perfect. Smugmug has great functionality that lets users email photos to friends with links that dump the friends right into my branded gallery... perfect. They even have a "send photos through email" function. I've given most of my supervisors camera-phones, so they can take job photos and send them to a hidden gallery. I get to review the photos and move the ones that are acceptable to the client galleries, thereby eliminating any "accidental" photos...

I really want clients to be able to manage their own change orders, so I can input stuff once (items, prices, photos, pdfs, etc...), let them research and debate using the information I give them, then basically say "yes or no" in the system. This is where Basecamp fails miserably. However, I've found something that I can plug into Basecamp that might just work. I'm going to use my Google Docs Spreadsheet that I started to collect all of the information. There's a web service called frevvo that basically makes forms out of your google spreadsheets. So, I can design a form that allows the user to:

a.) see the change order info (item or a collection of items, price, pdf/jpg, etc.)
b.) Select Accept or Reject, which will in-turn update my google spreadsheet in real-time. I think I can make it notify me via email as well.

If it's accepted, The spreadsheet will automatically add the change order total to the project total so the client can see the project total in real-time (and stop asking me to send updated job estimates every week/day/hour/minute/etc...)

I'll continue to update my findings....

kevins9999

Here's the update so far...

I'm using a combination of Basecamp, DabbleDB (which is a new(er) web-based database) and SmugMug. Here's the breakdown:

Basecamp - as the name implies, it's the central nervous system of each project. Each project in Basecam contains a message section (so messages are in the system and organized by categories (questions and comments, milestone related issues, and invoices.) We're going to advise clients to only send messages in the system, not via email. This will keep all project-related messages in a central location.

We also have a to-do section. This will serve three functions. We'll have two public to-do lists, Project Timeline and Punch List. The Project Timeline will get populated by us when the project starts. It will contain the client-friendly timeline that we can check-off as each part of the project is done (ie demolition, form footings, pour footings, etc...) The Punch-List is a list that the client can issue us "to-dos", (ie, there is a leak under the faucet). Each list item can contain comments and photo/document attachments if needed.

Then there's the milestone section, which we can use to assign dates to anything. We can, for example, make a milestone that says, "Please pick your plumbing fixtures," and attach a date of October 2nd. The client will see a list of all of their pending milestone items so that they act on the items in a timely fashion.

Lastly, there's a file repository that can handle any type of file (contracts, plans, etc.)

Then, I've created a mini-applicaiton using dabble-db that will handle all client selections and change orders. This contains 2 components. Component 1 is a live spreadsheet-type list that contains the original contract amount, along with all accepted change orders and the price of each change order. At the bottom? A live running total of the actual job cost.

The second component is the selection/change system itself. It presents each client with a list of their change orders which are categorized w/items. For example, we may have a change order called "Plumbing Fixtures" which contains 6 items. Each item has the name (which is a text field that can be anything), the amount and price. The client can, for each category, select "accept" or "decline." (They can only pick once...then the selection is locked-in and cannot be changed, unless they beg me I suppose... ) If they pick accept the item is automatically added to their job total list and the total is automatically updated. The system sends me an email so I'm alerted and I can enter the item in our accounting system. If they hit "decline," the item disappears from their view. I have a backend to this system, so I can see everything from every client in a nice, organized fashion.

Since DabbleDB is separate from Basecamp, I am putting a link to the Dabble-DB sub-system in each project. It's one line of code that's automatically generated by DabbleDB that I just have to paste in the "Overview" section. This pops-up the sub-system in a new window. The total sheet is embedded into the overview, so it's one of the first thing each client sees.

Then, part 3 of the system is the photo gallery. For this I'm using SmugMug. Each client gets their own gallery, which is accessable from a private url. I put the link to this url on the front page as well, and it pops open a new window with the gallery. The client can view pictures, comment on them, and also send the entire gallery to their friends and family via email. The gallery is branded with my logo and info. SmugMug has a cool feature that lets you email photos to a "drop-box." I can then just move the photos into the appropriate client gallery. Even though this is an extra step, it will allow my employees to upload photos, which I can then review (important...as you may imagine...) and post.

I'm making a training video for clients that will show them how to use the system. I'll gladly post the link if anyone's interested (once it's done!)

kevins9999

Ok... it's up. I added a weather widget in addition to everything mentioned above.

I recorded an screencast tutorial and walk-through for our clients. If anyone would like to see it, please email me for the link (I'd rather not publish it for the *entire* world.)... kevin (at) 4labuild.com

Monarch

Hi, I’m Pat and I just started to check this out from my business tool. I’ m new to the internet and started to use it to get some bids and jobs working with a new software product. I left more information about how I get jobs on the other topic of “trying myonlinetoolbox”. Not sure how to link between stories so you have to go to it your self.

Cole

I have been looking for something very similar, but the big problem I am running into is, I want to host it on my own server.

I think it will have to be custom built, unless I can find something similar that I can work with to make it what I want.

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Tulsa's Leader in Outdoor Living Construction | Facebook | Tulsa Pergola Builder | Tulsa Outdoor Kitchens

rbsremodeling

Cole have you looked at smart contractor??

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Cole

Rory,
I have looked at so many damn packages, I had to take notes of the pros / cons of each. I need to dig up that sheet and take a look at it again.

Did you end going with smartcontractor? If so how do you like it?

I really really want online client collaboration, I spend way too much time on the phone or sending emails, I want to get that to slow down, way down. I want a central place where a client can go and access all of their project information, ask questions etc...

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Tulsa's Leader in Outdoor Living Construction | Facebook | Tulsa Pergola Builder | Tulsa Outdoor Kitchens