Materials selection by clients - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

avrcustomhomes · 08-19-2006, 08:07 PM

Hi Everyone!

I am a small homebuilder in the Tampa Bay area. I started about 1 year ago and I am just in the process of completing my first custom home for very close friends. Because they are friends, they have worked with me in going to different locations to pick materials (flooring, cabinets, plumbing) from a pre-defined list and budget I created for them.

Any ideas on how to do this more efficiently when you are starting and your budget is limited? How can you find vendors that offer showrooms in your area but be able to keep things affordable? I want to be able to have a process that is professional and caters to working couples that don't have to much time to spend running around.

Any ideas are appreciated...

Thanks
Tony

Peladu · 08-19-2006, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avrcustomhomes

Any ideas on how to do this more efficiently when you are starting and your budget is limited?

Get handouts for the products you prefer and have them to show your customers at the kitchen table.

Quote:

Originally Posted by avrcustomhomes

How can you find vendors that offer showrooms in your area but be able to keep things affordable?

I have found that the venders whom have their showroom opened up for you to use, are typically not affordable for a low budget job.

Quote:

Originally Posted by avrcustomhomes

I want to be able to have a process that is professional and caters to working couples that don't have to much time to spend running around.

Maybe spec the doors, windows, roofing, and other basics, then have them pick out cabinets and other trim aspect of the house. This will make work for you easier also, when it comes time to bid the job out and getting away from so many allowances.

But face it, the customer is going to have to walk into a store and pick things out, no matter how easy you make it for them. And then you also get the customers who want to touch and feel everything and have no interest in looking at a brochure.

scottstef · 08-19-2006, 11:42 PM

the key word is CUSTOM. people are getting the privilge of getting it the way they want it. since you are speaking of people that are budget concious, they get to spend their time instead of their money and run from store to store checking out their selections. if they don't wnat to go through that, then they should upgrade and go to a high dollar gallery or hire a decorator.

btw, when i get stuck going shopping (or any other administrative task that i really hate to do), i bill the customers for it at almost double my work rate from the time i get in the car until i get to where i want to go next. i figure if they want me to blow 3 hours walking through home depot, great, i will go, they can pay me, and if i get lucky, they even buy me a hot dog from the roach coach. i also make sure they realize that and it is included in the original bid and that they sign that up front.

maj · 08-20-2006, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Get handouts for the products you prefer and have them to show your customers at the kitchen table.

I do this in the early stages of product selection. Works great to get a feel of the customers style & taste. Every time I'm in a lumberyard, big box, or specialty supply store I grab all the free stuff I can. I also have boxes full of sample products, so they can actually see & feel the product.

Quote:

I have found that the venders whom have their showroom opened up for you to use, are typically not affordable for a low budget job.

Very true with privately owned or smaller chain stores, but the big box stores (Menards, HD, Lowes, etc...) have fairly decent showrooms for the budget minded.

Quote:

the key word is CUSTOM. people are getting the privilge of getting it the way they want it.

Exactly....... You can do budget minded customs, but the choices are limited for products. Cheap products may look good, but the quality and longevity will be minimal. You may spend alot of time with follow-up R&R and warranty work.

Quote:

i figure if they want me to blow 3 hours walking through home depot, great, i will go, they can pay me,

Yep...... time is money when you're spending it on your customer. My contracts are to BUILD the house, not select the products.

Quote:

Any ideas on how to do this more efficiently when you are starting and your budget is limited? How can you find vendors that offer showrooms in your area but be able to keep things affordable? I want to be able to have a process that is professional and caters to working couples that don't have to much time to spend running around.

Spend a little of your own time visiting ALL the supply stores & vendors within a few miles of your target market area. Visit with the owners or managers and see what they can offer you for your continueing & loyal business. If you can convince them that you will give them 100% of your business, then they will work with you on pricing and selling the products. Find one or two that will work with you, then work at maintaining a good relationship with the owner or manager.

Peladu · 08-20-2006, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peladu

I have found that the venders whom have their showroom opened up for you to use, are typically not affordable for a low budget job.

Quote:

Originally Posted by maj

Very true with privately owned or smaller chain stores, but the big box stores (Menards, HD, Lowes, etc...) have fairly decent showrooms for the budget minded.

I can safely say that when I think, Mendards, HD, Lowes, the last thing
that pops into my head is the word showroom.

maj · 08-20-2006, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peladu

I can safely say that when I think, Mendards, HD, Lowes, the last thing
that pops into my head is the word showroom.

Oh I definitely agree with that.... My point was, for the budget minded & time strapped consumer, these places do have the various products on display for the customer to at least see the different products out there. I only said that statement because the original poster was asking for places to take customers that don't have alot of time to spend in showrooms.

Mike Finley · 08-20-2006, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avrcustomhomes

Hi Everyone!

I am a small homebuilder in the Tampa Bay area. I started about 1 year ago and I am just in the process of completing my first custom home for very close friends. Because they are friends, they have worked with me in going to different locations to pick materials (flooring, cabinets, plumbing) from a pre-defined list and budget I created for them.

Any ideas on how to do this more efficiently when you are starting and your budget is limited? How can you find vendors that offer showrooms in your area but be able to keep things affordable? I want to be able to have a process that is professional and caters to working couples that don't have to much time to spend running around.

Any ideas are appreciated...

Thanks
Tony

One doesn't go with the other. You either have to get a sample room or design room established like the big builders where the customer comes to the single source design center and picks everything or you have to send them to 2 dozen places across the metro area to pick things out.

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 09:22 PM

I am ignorant of this aspect, so help me to understand. The owners do not know what they want, and leave it up to the builder to decide on fixtures? Or is it that after the inital budgeting the owners want the builder to present a range of choices for them to choose from?

Either way, I do not understand why it is within the builder's scope of work to provide this service. It is something the owner has total responsability for, or if they do not want to do so assign to a designer?

In the case of a tract builder, sure, there is a design center where these choices are made, but in the case of a custom home or remodeler, it appears to be outside the purview of the builder.

Correct me if I am wrong, please.

maj · 08-20-2006, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tscarborough

I am ignorant of this aspect, so help me to understand. The owners do not know what they want, and leave it up to the builder to decide on fixtures? Or is it that after the inital budgeting the owners want the builder to present a range of choices for them to choose from?

Either way, I do not understand why it is within the builder's scope of work to provide this service. It is something the owner has total responsability for, or if they do not want to do so assign to a designer?

In the case of a tract builder, sure, there is a design center where these choices are made, but in the case of a custom home or remodeler, it appears to be outside the purview of the builder.
Correct me if I am wrong, please.

I don't know if you are necessarily wrong or not, maybe just the way you perceive it. I perceive it as totally opposite of what you described.
I do not get involved with tract building what-so-ever, all my building is custom home building. For me, tract building means you get what the builder puts in the house, there are minimal, if any, decisions left to the customer. Where as a custom, the possibilities are endless, with only the budget being the dtermining factor.

mdshunk · 08-20-2006, 09:35 PM

I've been reading this thread as it progresses, and I still can't figure out one thing. Why does the builder feel it necessary to accompany the client to these places to pick out stuff? Why can't the builder let the client know the allowance for the items, give them some suggestions of places to go, and the date they need the decision by?

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 09:38 PM

I come at it from the stand point of "custom tract builders", 300,000 to about 1.2 million bucks, who offer some of my products in their showrooms (prearranged between me and them). The real custom builders, million bucks up, send their clients to me to choose from my samples/showroom. I assist the owner, then they tell the builder their choice. Allowances are not usually a factor, which is part of my confusion.

mdshunk · 08-20-2006, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tscarborough

Allowances are not usually a factor, which is part of my confusion.

Right, that's confusing me too. If the builder has a 98 cent per square foot allowance for tile, and the client really likes the 20 dollar a foot tile, it shouldn't ever be a problem for the builder. The client just has to come up with 19 bucks a square foot. Where they pick it out, and at what cost, shouldn't be an issue. Handholding by the builder while this selection is made seems weird.

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 09:47 PM

Very. I am asked on a daily basis "do you think this matches", or "how do you think this looks with that". My standard reply is that it looks great to me, but I will only be looking at it for about 10 minutes, while you will look at it for the rest of your life. I refuse to implicate myself in their personal choices, unless they are willing to pay me a consulting fee.

mdshunk · 08-20-2006, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tscarborough

I am asked on a daily basis "do you think this matches", or "how do you think this looks with that". My standard reply is....

I don't want to be involved in light fixture selection at all. In no way, whatsoever. Lighting is a little like jewelry. Everybody's got different tastes. If I'm asked if I like it, or if it will look good, I comment on the quality (or lack thereof) of the fixture, and not the aestetics. That's what decorators and designers are for. I don't expect the painter will be answering their electrical questions, so I'm not gonna do the designer's job either. The beginning and end of my fixture consulation might be to advise if the fixture will physically fit in the space without creating a hazard.

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 09:59 PM

Exactly. Frank Loyd Wright did a house from soup to nuts, but for the rest of us mere mortals, to use a common phrase, "it ain't my F'n JOB", to assist with choosing fixtures, textures and colors.

That said, I do have many custom builders who DO consider it their job to assist with those choices, but they do not kick the responsability down to the level of suppliers, contractors, or even the owner.

maj · 08-20-2006, 10:26 PM

Well obviously we have the all too often demographic difference coming into play here. Again, I do not live in a metropolitan area where large showrooms & designers are readily available. We do not build $1 mil homes.

Quote:

Why does the builder feel it necessary to accompany the client to these places to pick out stuff?

Because the customers trust our experience and knowledge of the whole building process. Rather than talking with dozens of different salespeople trying to sell their products, they trust us to help them make their decisions.

Quote:

Why can't the builder let the client know the allowance for the items, give them some suggestions of places to go, and the date they need the decision by?

Yep, exactly. But some people will drag their feet or come back from the showrooms totally confused. So they "beg" for our honest and unbiased opinions. If that means taking a day to "hold their hand", then so be it. This time is billed as extra, of course.

Quote:

The real custom builders, million bucks up, send their clients to me to choose from my samples/showroom. I assist the owner, then they tell the builder their choice.

Here again is the difference between where you live and where I live. I am very midwest & conservative. I do not classify myself as a builder, at least not in the respect that you do. So I completely understand where you're coming from, but the fact is, we just do not have those types around here.

Quote:

Allowances are not usually a factor, which is part of my confusion.

So everything is time & material? I usually build turnkey, so allowances HAVE to be a factor.

Quote:

If the builder has a 98 cent per square foot allowance for tile, and the client really likes the 20 dollar a foot tile, it shouldn't ever be a problem for the builder. The client just has to come up with 19 bucks a square foot.

Now this is confusing to me? So the client pays the supplier the extra $19/ sq.ft.? Or is it because of the time & material way of building? It costs what it costs?

maj · 08-20-2006, 10:36 PM

Now you guys got me confused!!!???

First you say this.......

Quote:

I do not understand why it is within the builder's scope of work to provide this service. It is something the owner has total responsability for, or if they do not want to do so assign to a designer?

Quote:

but in the case of a custom home or remodeler, it appears to be outside the purview of the builder.

Quote:

The real custom builders, million bucks up, send their clients to me to choose from my samples/showroom. I assist the owner, then they tell the builder their choice.

Then you say this.....

Quote:

I do have many custom builders who DO consider it their job to assist with those choices, but they do not kick the responsability down to the level of suppliers, contractors, or even the owner.

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 10:42 PM

It is confusing, and market driven, but I guess my bottom line is why is it up to the builder, no matter what the scale, to decide what the homeowner wants?

I know if I was building my own home, I would pick my fixtures, textures and colors, with no regard to what the builder suggested, other than to stay within allowances.

maj · 08-20-2006, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tscarborough

It is confusing, and market driven, but I guess my bottom line is why is it up to the builder, no matter what the scale, to decide what the homeowner wants?

I know if I was building my own home, I would pick my fixtures, textures and colors, with no regard to what the builder suggested, other than to stay within allowances.

Who said anything about that? That's the whole purpose of custom building, they get what they want!!!! That's why I prefer to do that type of work.

Tscarborough · 08-20-2006, 11:08 PM

They get what they want, but it is your job (as the builder) to provide the selection. That is what the inital poster stated, I think.