chompchomp12

I am looking for some practical advice. Ever since I was in College I’ve wanted to go into commercial construction. Since my school does not offer a Construction Management degree, I graduated with a degree in Civil Engineering with an emphasis in structural design. When I graduated college construction and engineering jobs were few and far between (this was before the economy boomed). I landed a jab in a civil design firm and practice land development engineering and have been here ten years now. I recieved my P.E. and figured to build upon my skill. Although the money is good, I work for a small firm and I can not advance any further than I have, plus my desire to work in construction burns in my belly. I have taken construction management courses at a local community college since there are programs at the University level in Chicago. After taking these courses and interviewing with every company. I have found out 2 things:

1. Construction companies prefer engineers who have worked in structural design firms as opposed to land development firms.
2. Construction companies go to the universities for Construction management managers as opposed to the community college level.

Understand this, the design profession is boring and if I get in to construction I can always do design work on the side. Here is my question. How does someone with my back round and desire get my foot in the door? Should I look for people with experience and form a partnership and form a small company and learn from them? If so where do I find these people?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Same Old

Don't ever form a partnership.

ever.

chompchomp12

I understand where you are coming from. Law suits, partner dies, leaves, it gets messed up I've thought about that. But with no experience in the process. I'm thinking out loud and trying to figure out how I surround myself with a support system of experienced people in a possible venture.

I've thought about buying a business but then I fell as if I am financing someone'e retirement. You buy the comany name, inherit the company staff, and then what hope you get enough work to pay off the big loan you take on in buying the firm.

mikesewell

Go to work for a large construction firm for a while to get yourself some field experience, and to make some good connections. Then you can do as you please. Your education gives you a huge edge, use it.

If your lack of field experience is a problem for the big guys, start with a smaller firm.

Check your state's DOT website for the list of contracts awarded for the last year. Check the USACE website too. That will give you a long list of the most important firms that are active in your area. Check the web for your local Contractors Association. Join.

Be a little careful at first, you will be judged by the company that you keep...

If you just can't stand working for someone else and you really really feel that you have to go on your own right now, hire seasoned veterans, and let them play a large role in making the decisions. Be warned however, that if you go this route, you are in for some serious class warefare for a while until you get some mud on your boots, LOL. It's kind of like Miss Manners hiring Larry the cable guy...

Best regards,
Michael

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

Mud Master

Get some field experience. The education you have is vital, and will serve you well, and act as an advantage. But the classroom time in design and development will not hold a candle to learning and understanding both what goes on in the field and how things are done. Even if you hire a skilled mechanic or foreman, you are at a disadvantage as you do not know what he is doing, and how he is doing it. If you are with a customer and they ask you "how would you re route this pipe?" or "how do you do XXX?". It's great to be able to be able to design the things, and see them on the computer, or on the blueprints. But until you build an addition for yourself, or re roof a home, or remodel a kitchen, or pour concrete, or frame a wall, or tape drywall, you are at a disadvantage. See what I am saying?

I am not saying what you have learned or what you know is not a assest. Believe me, if I knew how design or develop, other than what I know from being in the field, I would be a better business man. When I designed my home, I knew what was loadbearing and what was not, and how to pour a structrual foundation, but if I could have designed it from a engineer's perspective, it proboly would have taken out alot of guess work while I was building it.

So go to work for someone for a minimum of 5 or 6 years, preferbly more, and get the field experience under your belt. I know it's not the do it than think solution, but it's the right one.

Good Luck! and hang around here, you'll learn alot.

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chompchomp12

The one thing I've learned from College is that I don't know anything. Trust me you don't. I gave me a great backround. Like I said I'm Thinking out loud trying to include my skill set to a profession I want to get in. Being in Chicago I know that the big boys are looking for only Construction Management majors from Pudrue, Bradley, and Milwakee School of Engineering. The small compny route is probably the best way to get my feet wet. With a small company at least you can see how things get done, especially on the business end of things.

I'll do my research further, I do enjoy this forum. Thank you all for your input.

mikesewell

Proboly fresh outta school, an' just needin' to be learnt how to GIT 'ER DONE!

Best regards,
Michael

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

Bob Kovacs

I'm surprised you're having a hard time finding a job. I'm thinking the only thing preventing you from landing on is that you're probably trying to step in at too high of a level so you can retain the same/similar salary range.

Our company ($400 million/year commercial GC/CM) has a mix of CM and CE grads, so the problem definitely isn't the degree you possess. The difficulty is, without hands-on previous CM experience, we'd be looking to start you as a project engineer or assistant PM, which would pay in the $50-60k/year range here in NJ. I'm assuming that with 10 years of civil experience and a PE, you're probably looking to make more than that, but it's not going to happen unless you can show me that you're fully capable of running a job on your own (which I'm presuming you wouldn't be able to do).

Bob

vinylguy

look its a dog eat dog world in the construction industry and comm. work is really time consuming. if you have a family life or want one than stay away! but if you like working 24-7 running on empty waiting 60-90 days for your money. dealing with engineers who don't know thier arse from a hole in the ground. and dealing with employess that never show up and oh yeah lets not forget osha then by all means jump right in grab the bull by the horns its a wild ride. sometimes great sometimes not so great but always an adventure. now 10 years from now if you last that long you'll say thats the best piece of advice i ever got.

mikesewell

Welcome to the field, Engineer.

I hope you enjoy it as much as I have.

Regards,
Michael

P.S. Always wear ear protection so you don't suffer too much damage to your ego. LOL.

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

chompchomp12

Bob:

I've contemplated everything you said, and understood that thereprobably be would be a pay cut. Maybe I waited to long to jump into construction. It's hard to take a huge paycut with a martgage to pay, a small pay cut I would understanding that the potential to make move up exists. Some companies were offering close to what I was making a few thousand less than my current job. I just never got called back, maybe I am a bad interview. I also understand I would not be a PM right away because of the lack of experience. Evereything you have stated I have considered and stated in interviews. No dice.

I don't know maybe I waited too long to try and get in the field. A few year I've outpriced myself from the industry.

I just want you guys to know just because of my degree and experience it dosen't make me anything. The more I admit to not knowing the more I learn. As a design professional I don't know my Arsehole from a manhole! one day I learn. I hope.

Again thanks for every one's input.

mikesewell

Sounds like maybe you could project a little more self-confidence.

Best regards,
Michael

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

thom

About 30 years ago I made the jump into construction. At that time I had about $30,000 in the bank, infinite energy, minimum personal expenses, and a desire to succeed.

I worked 80-100 hours weekly, hired professionals, paid them top dollar, with the understanding that, in addition to doing their job, they were teaching me how to do it. I worked hard, studied hard and became competent in every phase of construction.

I joke that I started at the top and worked my way down, but that's what I did.

I never asked for help bidding, I just went with my gut. I learned real fast because I was playing with my own money. I'm a meticulous bookkeeper and monitored everyting in detail in the early years.

It's a risky business. I've done both residential and commercial. Commercial pays much better, has more demanding schedules, less pain-in-the-ass customers, and you wait for your money. You must have the working capital to work commercial but the upside is, you aren't competing with the guys working out of a pick-up with no cash in the bank.

Name recognition is overrated if you are in a good size market. When someone wants to remodel an office, store, restaurant, etc. they go to the phone book. Today they probably do the internet thing too.

Trade Masters

Hey Chomp,
Don't get discouraged! My education was in LAW and yet here I am today! Case in point,
When I wanted to uderstand the economy in a new market (we moved to a different are of the country) I threw mud (delivered concrete) for a year or so to better understand the local building industry and customs. The money bites but the education has taken me a million miles.

If you wish to get into the building industry, then learn the building industry from the ground up. Your degree was a great move...THEN. I look at it like this, when I need a concrete consultant, "Do I want a guy who has read alot of books and has a degree?, or, Do I want the guy who's swung a chute for thirty plus years and knows that concrete cracks with the direction the wind blows?"

Other posts would have you work for someone else in a mediocre position for 6-10 years. I say start at the bottom of where you want to be and then dance when you are ready to dance. A guy with a degree is going to put up with ALOT of $%$# in a year or 18 months but when you are ready to do it yourself, you'll know. I was that guy!

My best to you,
Greg

The plumber

These guys have given you some good advice. It bites, but if you start from the bottom and work your way up it will be a walk in the park in the years to come. If you have the lower level experience you will get more respect from the guys below you also.

Tmrrptr

Chomp, when I get home from a day's work I'd like to sit down in an easy chair and pop a top in front of the TV... but I've got the days paperwork to do, and prep for the next day.
Something else, on the side?

Well, it's kinda rare.

If you are a full time office type person, I could see wanting to do something physical after work...
r

constructonomics

I worked for a land development civil engineering for two years before going to grad school for construction managment. It is correct that job site folk don't like nerdy college grads, but that I changing. I would try to get on a big project with a lot of structural steel or concrete and be the technical expert for those parts of the building. You'll have to learn the contracting and management side, but I think that will come with time.

I thought consulting engineering was boring as well.

SLSTech

2007 Guys - it is both the year of the post in question & the last time Chompy was logged on

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CScalf

YEAH WHAT HE SAID....

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Everytime it's a newbie!

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