How Much "free" Hand Holding...

bert0168

I've been lurking about for awhile and getting some great advice and tips from you guys here, but now I have a dilemma about how to deal with a potential customer with whom I "may" have some upcoming work.

First, some history. I originally looked at this job that involved some Anderson doors that had failure along the bottom edges and some aluminum trim work around the garage doors. This mainly involves the Anderson doors, one slider and one Frenchwood, about 11 years old, 5 panels in all to replace. The doors are in working order other than the failures I mentioned. The homeowner also complained about the slider not operating smoothly, which is only an adjustment issue. I went to the site and evaluated the work, told the homeowner that the frames were in good shape and that it would be much cheaper to have me get the panels from the amnufacturer, remove the bad panels and replace with new panels. Sounds simple, right?

Here is the problem I am having. I know most of you don't like free estimates, but where I live there is no way to survive if you try to charge up front for estimates. So I give the HO 1st estimate free. I get e-mail with some questions concerning the estimate. I reply via e-mail, no problem. Then again with more questions. I am slightly annoyed, but respond no problem. Then I get request to quote removing the slider and replacing with a new unit. Doors are in stucco wall and we all know how that goes. I reply with new prices and a cost comparasion vs. replacing the 5 panels. HO finally decides to have the 5 panels replaced. Anderson is giving the HO a 58% disc since the panels are 9 mo outside warranty. Problem is HO have dragged this on so long I am now outside the 30 day Anderson quote. So, now I call Anderson, get a new quote which went up $95, send off another e-mail to comfirm and request a deposit of the panel cost only, since they are shipped directly to them and have a beer to celebrate another job on my sched.

Well I get an e-mail today from the husband (been dealing w/ her till now) says he wants me to come over to the house AGAIN, to meet him so he can get a handle on how the panels are going to look when done. I am so off at this point that I think I want to walk from this. I don't get many PITA customers (only 2 in 12 yrs) but I think this may be one. I either need a graceful way out or I want to charge them for this additional visit which by the way has to be after 6:00 pm so he can be there.

Sorry this rant is so long but I really could use some advice on this one.

Heritage

At the end it's all up to you. There has been a lot of discussion/debate here about this type of stuff.

But since you asked I'll give you my opinion.

You're too nice. Get a deposit. Send them a letter and in the last paragraph ask for a deposit if they want you to proceed. If they say no, walk away and pat yourself on the back for saving yourself a lot of money and aggrevation.

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genecarp

we all have different limits. only you know when enough is enough. since you posted here, i expect you are at your limit, to avoid in the future, get deposit earlier in the process. set boundries early on. i have some 100,000 dollar per year customers, they call, i go. as often as they need me.

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Tao_Rider

Trust your instincts, run. Refer them to someone after telling them you are to busy or this type of work is outside your scope. Use the energy to generate higher quality leads.

Mike
Planet Earth
North American Continent

Bob Kovacs

Depends- if it's a $10,000 job, it might be worth a trip to hold his hand one more time and pick up a deposit check- if its a $500 job, I'd tell him to go scratch.

bert0168

Thanks for the replies. I agree with everything said so far. The job is only 3K and my margin is tight as it is on this one. Problem is I started on this over a month ago and am right on the verge of getting them to sign.

I was thinking a little after my first post of a possible solution so tell me what you think.

I contact HO and tell him I can only meet in the am, which is what I prefer and fits MY schedule better. If he is agreeable and we meet, I bring the finalized estimate WITH an additional line charge for the additional time I have spent back and forth with them. I ask them to sign on the spot since there isn't anything else at this point to think about. If they refuse and want to "discuss" it further, then I tell them I may not be a good match for their needs and walk away.

Although my instincts still want me to run, I want to know how I could word the line charge for "additional time" if I decide I need the punishment?

rbsremodeling

Put the line item charge as consultation fee.

Your response now is exactly as what I was going to suggest to you.

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Stone Mountain

all that additional time, emailing and hand holding is just part of the job. If I were the homeowner and I was asked for additional money for a second visit, I'd find someone else.
I often go to see a potential client twice, and in once case this year 4 times ( I got the $20,000 sale). There IS no diplomatic way to tell a client you're spending too much time with him.

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mdshunk

I think I'd be "busy" for a couple 3 or 4 months. You've probably already blown your margin fussing with them, and more is sure to come. You havn't even started the job, for real, yet. Imagine how it's gonna be when you do? Phonecalls every evening, at home?

Tom R

The customer's a contol freak, - - and will make you visit at least 5 times after the job is completely done to get paid. Drop him.

user15686

This is why, I have the requirement that all decision makers are present at the initial appointment.

Trimcat

I agree with Tom R.. Drop him and run for the hills. He's trouble.

wellbuilthome

I would keep working the lead . I had a lead this spring that wanted a deck ,so i priced it, wanted a porch so i priced it, wanted a bathroom , pavers driveway, 18x 22 addition, new heat & A/C ,tile ,wood stove ect .I had 26 hours into the lead . I sold the hole job . I didnt think they where buying. some times it takes a little longer. I hate to let a lead go.

Greg Di

And we all know how that turned out.....

http://www.contractortalk.com/f16/sweet-job-going-south-40353/

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mahlere

now if that's not the perfect reason to walk away...

Mike Finley

You're going to drop a charge on him now all of a sudden? In an area where you said yourself you can't charge for an estimate?

Good luck with that one.

How about simply replying to his email.

Hi Stan,

Got your email. I'm in the middle of a big job right now and I don't think I will have the time to stop by. What exactly are you concerned with in regard to the panels? Please call me at 555-555-5555 and we can discuss it over the phone.

Thanks,
Bert.


Stop all the time wasting. Use the phone, stop making trips. Start asking questions. (Again, this is always the answer for you guys who are in these situations.) Ask the customer questions instead of waiting and seeing what they want to do.

Handyman Jim

Sometimes because of bowing in the area of the threashold, settling, the way the door was originaly installed,etc. problems arise that you don't see until you get into it. Both the job and the customers could be a real time killer.

http://www.handymanjimnoonan.com

Jason Whipple

I hate to say it, but it sounds like this is where the problem started. If your margin wasn't so "tight" and you're one step away from closing the deal, I doubt you would have any issues with your time invested. A bid of $3,500.00 would have solved all that.

Like Mike said, do as much work on the phone and in emails as you can. When they are ready to sign, make one more trip.

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aikenback

you have to decide if you are a contractor who helps people through the decision making process to arrive at an informed decision and course of action, or a tradesman that does a job which has already been decided on and handed to you in black and white for you to complete. Your price should reflect your philosophy and you should explain these different prices and services to yuor customer.