Always Always Get A Signed Contract

pknyryan

I have a customer that I met on Craigslist (of all places) that I have been doing work for, several small jobs. Well, I did 3 jobs so far, no contract, just verbal prices. I built a deck, installed and entry door, and installed an 8' slider.

All of these jobs have been done over the weekend with my helper, and the customer has paid me 1/2 at the end of the first day and the remainder on the second day, upon completion.

Now I am in the middle of doing a light bartroom remodel and have been working there all week. Told them Wednesday that I need a 1500 payment on Thursday as I am about 75% done and I need to pay my helper. Their balance will be 800, which is to tile the floor and do the trim work. So, today it is Friday and there is no payment, so after I put a second coat of tape on the walls, I packed up and left after a mild argument with the customer which resulted in a 1500 check being written that I was unable to cash as it was one of those credit card advance checks.

So now the lady is telling me that it's not fair, I never asked for money until Wednesday and it takes 5 days for her to access her money. The thing is that she knew for 6 weeks that we were starting the job ths week, and I told her she should have funds available to pay, as I would have been finished tomorrow if I worked all day today and tomorrow.

So as it sits, I am owed 2300, what should I do? I am under the impression that they want to pay, but they are trying to get the money together. I told them that when they have their financial situation in order to call me and I will come out for 2 days and finish, after I get a 1500 payment. And I have given them a very specific and detailed contract to sign, and I need the contract and a payment before I continue working. So far I have done over 3K for work for them (which isn't a lot to most but I am a small time operation and this weekend work has helped a lot)

I also stipulated in the contract that I want payment in full upon completion.


What suggestions would anyone have on here on the best course of action to take to rectify this problem. I'm sure I will end up finishing the job, should I go ahead and finies it this weekend, or should I wait for payment?

kevjob

I think your title of the thread says it all. I would collect what I am owed and not continue until monies are paid.

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Kevin
Basement Finishing Highlands Ranch Colorado
Littleton Colorado, Basement Remodeling
Kitchen Remodeling Denver

AtlanticWBConst

I think the first line of your post says it all.

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- Build Well -

genecarp

one thing , dont let the relationship get adversarial, explain to them that you would love to continue working, however suppliers are demanding money, and you must go to another job to earn money to pay for there material.

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AtlanticWBConst

As already known - get signed contracts. However, that won't necessarily guarantee you being paid on time.

FWIW: We don't like to "demand" payment from clients.

We keep a cash reserve in our company account that we use to pay our help and our subcontractors, so that we are not working "paycheck-to-paycheck".
That is a bad habit for any company, business, or contractor to get into. Personally, I feel that, when you put your self in a position of: "Hey, I finished your job/phase of your job, and I need to get paid right now, now, now..." - It comes across as very unprofessional.

We do not like to "push" or be forceful when we are put in a position to ask for payment. We have stipulated payments in our contracts, and have had people drag a payment, or not pay on time....simply because they are dissorganized, scatter-brained, or forgetful. We will ask them, when they can give us the payment, and that is fine..... When you work paycheck - to - paycheck, and need that money at the end of the week to pay your help, and are forced to chase down your clients to do it, it creates a very unprofessional and unpleasant atmosphere between paying clients (even slow paying ones) and their contractor. Don't be "one of those" contractors.

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AtlanticWBConst

It's obviously a misunderstanding. She didn't realize things, and you have no way of knowing how her finances work (she needs 5 days). Some people are forgettful, or a bit loopy...

Keep working and smile....

You seem to feel that they plan on paying you, so what's the problem? Some contractors have people that don't want to pay them....
As far as the signed contract goes, you could tell them it is state law that you must have a signed contract (it is in my state).

Good for you.

They obviously have paid you. Yeah, it's a shame that it was a credit card check. But it still cleared, right? Or do you not have a bank account?

If they have not paid you at all in the course of this project, and have not signed the contract, then that is definitely a point of concern.
a.) They did pay you. B.) Get that contract signed.

As far as a suggestion (this may be a little harsh, but take it for what it's worth):
IMHO: Stop coming-across ... being hard-up to get your "cash" when you want it. You are coming across the wrong way. You are presenting a very unprofessional image. Try handling your business finances better, and showing a little more patience with the clients.

After all, you did find them on Craig's list....(you went looking for them)...

Good Luck.

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- Build Well -

W-Tinc

They may be completely innocent and it was just a misunderstanding.

On the other hand..small rant..
I have a small percentage of customers who even though they know they need to give me x amount at x time are not prepared to do so.

It drives me crazy... finish up and be ready to go then have to wait 30 minutes for them to run to the bank(after they sat on the couch watching jerry springer all day ), or have them tell me not to cash the check for a few days because they need to move some money around.

Very inconsiderate at best, not sure if its my fault somehow that they think its ok to waste my time, or just that they in general don't appreciate the time of people who work for them. Maybe they just don't want to think about paying the bill until they have to.

Sounds like the people you are working for are trying to be good customers.

You are right, you will eliminate the vast majority of those problems by clearly spelling out work and payment details in a contract.

Greg Di

My payment milestones are there for a reason. I am never ahead of the customer and they are never ahead of me. With certain customers, I will be more casual about collecting the money, but with most I expect the money to be in my hand when I complete the milestone. There is nothing unprofessional about it. There's no place I know that I can purchase items and then think about paying for them for a few days. Why should we be different.

But...if you are working without a contract...I don't even know what to tell you other than shame on you and you know better.

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AtlanticWBConst

I agree, there us nothing unprofessional about asking, reminding, or billing a client for a scheduled payment.
However, working without a signed contract can be looked at as being....unprofessional...

Every supply house we do orders and business with allows that. If you are serious about your profession, you should have accounts with suppliers that allow you a 30 day period for payment of materials (unless you can't get that kind of credit for some reason).


The point of what is unprofessional is this (Nothing against the OP, this is the premise that we all have seen, and we all know can occur frequently):

Contractor works paycheck to paycheck...and says to the client: "I need my scheduled payment." Customer says, basically, I need a little more time to get it (I forgot, my head is foggy, I ran out of checks, etc), but I will get it to you in such-&-such time, or on such-&-such date....
Contractor blows his top, and says, No, I need my cash NOW!!, because I need to pay my help with your cash payment (because I don't even have $500 to $600 in my business account to pay my helper)....um...that's professional?
Client says, I just need a little more time to transfer this money to that account. Contractor says; "Heck no, You pay, or I walk!"

I am sorry, but that is the kind of banter that you see play out between families on Gerry Springer, at the local corner bar at 3:00 pm, or that the court systems has to sort out between family members.....

Such "self-created" situations bring a very bad light on contractors in general, who are willing to be reasonable, patient, calm, flexible, and above all -professional....with their clients and their "signed" contracts.

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Grumpyplumber

I do a large number of smaller in-and-out service jobs that are under half a day.
On occasion I don't get a signature when it's a regular.
On smaller jobs I don't waste time writing out massive contracts for the obvious reason.
Anything thats more than a day, I get it signed in detail with all thats not included, anything without a signature on jobs this size is suicide.

One $10K job refusing the final payment at jobs end is a tough pill to swallow for a sole prop, and nothing in writing means no leg to stand on in court...no option for a mechanics lien, nothing but you claiming they owe you money.

Ten to one you'll get your payment, as you stated they've not been a problem in the past, but I'd learn from this if I were you.

pknyryan

Okay, first one thing to clear up. I was not able to cash the check they gave me.

I agree, I was a bit unprofessional, and I feel bad and have apologized and will not repeat in the future. I knew they were going to pay, it's just they should have had funds available, and like someone posted above, they forgot/neglected to make arrangements to have funds available.

Anyway, they went to the bank saturday morning and cashed a check from their credit card company, and made the payment that i asked for.

Tiger

I did an insurance job over a year ago ($20k?). I actually got an advance & installed the rough electrical. Time for the rough payment ($15k?) & the HO & Ins Co ganged up on me & refused payment until final. I stopped work. My contract saved me & I magically had a check the following Monday.

You never know for certain with new clients if they're being honest with you. Continuing work until final is risky. At final your leverage for payment is minimal. Stopping work can get the money moving.

On the other hand, if this is a repeat client with a good payment history sometimes I'll complete the project & let it go 30 days for payment.

Dave

Double-A

Contracting has a lot of parallels to a good personal relationship. Communication is the most important part of your job. If you're not communicating your expectations and listening to and meeting your client's expectations, the best you can hope for is to be 'just friends' after the break up.

Sounds like your client wants to be 'just friends'. Time to go fishing.

GL

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"My clients’ wishes are the center of my attention." -- David Guido, a contractor in Woodstock, N.Y.
New York Times, July 20, 2006

thom

The way I see it, the problem is yours.

You did not provide a written proposal for them to sign that detailed the scope of work and the pay schedule.

The point of contracts is to make it very clear to both parties what is expected of each and when. You didn't do this. Don't blame your customer for your failure to act in a businesslike manner.

Tiger

To the point & true. With a contract most problems can be solved by referring to the contract.

Dave