What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?

 
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Old 09-26-2017, 03:14 PM   #21
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


I would guess that solar shingles will be a small market player, at best, based on my experience in the business. It took metal 2 decades to gain widespread acceptance and a real world market share.
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Old 09-26-2017, 03:45 PM   #22
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


It's always problematic when a product is designed to do more than one function. Solar shingles sound great, will look good, but what happens when some of the shingles start failing and yes, panels do fail. How hard is it going to be to remove and replace the offending shingle?

With the continuing drop in PV prices the market is going to keep growing which is a good thing, the more decentralized we can be the better. In addition to panels there's also solar film, which has tremendous potential, not nearly as efficient but so much cheaper possibly as the technology advances.

Speaking of alternate energy a huge potential player is the fuel cell. There's a company right now producing fuel cells where a unit the size of a microwave generates enough power for an average house. This technology is real and will be coming to the consumer market sooner rather than later. Google's industrial park is powered by these cells, larger versions of them.

With our abundance of natural gas now and for the foreseeable future as well as the growing potential of biomass natural gas it's very likely energy prices will have the ability to really plummet increasing the attractiveness of the United States as a design and manufacturing hub.
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Old 09-26-2017, 03:56 PM   #23
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


Metal for roofing - and for cladding - have been around and wide spread for 150 plus years.

I grew up in a 5000 sf farmhouse with a metal roof over the original (1850s) cedar shake roof. If i had to guess, it was installed somewhere between 1890 - 1920.

There's something reassuring, at night when there's a big old thunderstorm raging all around outside, and you hear the rain smacking against the metal.

It's a product that has come into and out of favor several times.
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Old 09-26-2017, 04:07 PM   #24
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


I believe that the people developing solar shingles have given every aspect of installing/maintaining that product considerable thought.

So, whatever is required for defects etc - is on them. And its their problem for 30 years.

I also refer to the Apple model of business. Their buyers do not care and in fact do not want to know how the insides of their iPhone or tablet or desktop work. What they like is that whatever goes wrong - one call or one stop and "the company' takes care of it.

It is the main reason why people pay a hefty premium for the Apple brand over the IBM clones, or other makes of smartphones.

The millennials were brought up on this and the Amazon business model. They are the buyers stepping into the market place, and they will buy based on what THEY were brought up with.

The entire reason why Tesla bought Solar City is so they could have a read-made, trained, national work force, one familiar with the complexities of solar installations.
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Old 09-26-2017, 05:14 PM   #25
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


Quote:
Originally Posted by SmallTownGuy View Post
The entire reason why Tesla bought Solar City is so they could have a read-made, trained, national work force, one familiar with the complexities of solar installations.
You are selling Kool-Aid here.

The real reason Tesla bought SolarCity was to bail out SolarCity, the company his cousins, Peter and Lyndon Rive launched with Musk’s support in 2006. The business, an industry-rallying success for nearly a decade, had recently run into challenges. Its stock, once unstoppable, had dropped roughly 77% since its February 2014 peak. Its debt had mushroomed to $3.4 billion, sales growth had slowed, and the company was burning through $6 of cash for every dollar of revenue.

In other words, the company was on a fast track to bankruptcy. If SolarCity were to go under, then Musk would lose over $100 million of his own money invested into the company.

Six of Tesla’s seven directors have clear ties to SolarCity. Tesla’s board includes SolarCity’s former CFO, a SolarCity director, and two VCs whose firms also have seats on SolarCity’s board, along with Musk’s brother, Kimbal. Musk chairs both companies and is SolarCity’s largest shareholder. He has taken out $475 million in personal credit lines to buy more shares in SolarCity and Tesla when advantageous. SpaceX, his aerospace company, has purchased $165 million in bonds issued by SolarCity. Some analysts cautioned that Musk might be self-dealing, rescuing his own investments and his cousins’ company through this purchase. Hedge-fund manager Jim Chanos, who had shorted Tesla and SolarCity, called the acquisition a “shameful example of corporate governance at its worst,” a “bailout” of SolarCity that “strikes us as just the height of folly.”

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Old 09-26-2017, 05:43 PM   #26
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


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Originally Posted by RobertM View Post
You are selling Kool-Aid here.

The real reason Tesla bought SolarCity was to bail out SolarCity, the company his cousins, Peter and Lyndon Rive launched with Musk’s support in 2006. The business, an industry-rallying success for nearly a decade, had recently run into challenges. Its stock, once unstoppable, had dropped roughly 77% since its February 2014 peak. Its debt had mushroomed to $3.4 billion, sales growth had slowed, and the company was burning through $6 of cash for every dollar of revenue.

In other words, the company was on a fast track to bankruptcy. If SolarCity were to go under, then Musk would lose over $100 million of his own money invested into the company.

Six of Tesla’s seven directors have clear ties to SolarCity. Tesla’s board includes SolarCity’s former CFO, a SolarCity director, and two VCs whose firms also have seats on SolarCity’s board, along with Musk’s brother, Kimbal. Musk chairs both companies and is SolarCity’s largest shareholder. He has taken out $475 million in personal credit lines to buy more shares in SolarCity and Tesla when advantageous. SpaceX, his aerospace company, has purchased $165 million in bonds issued by SolarCity. Some analysts cautioned that Musk might be self-dealing, rescuing his own investments and his cousins’ company through this purchase. Hedge-fund manager Jim Chanos, who had shorted Tesla and SolarCity, called the acquisition a “shameful example of corporate governance at its worst,” a “bailout” of SolarCity that “strikes us as just the height of folly.”
What part of that matters to me? Or to anybody buying a new home?

Answer: None of it.

What matters is that Solar City has the largest share of the PV panel market in the US. That means it has the largest distribution channels and trained workforce.

Buying Solar City on the cheap is a smart move.

YOU have an axe to grind. You certainly are negative and seem pissed off at the world.

I only care about where the market is going.

And get this: Tesla/Solar City is just one player among several.

But you seem to be hung up on Tesla for some reason.
(shrugs)
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Old 09-26-2017, 06:23 PM   #27
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


I pointed out some major fallacies in your logic and all you are doing is resorting to personal attacks.

I think you are the one pissed at the world and filled with negativity.

An irrefutable fact is that a typical homeowner simply does not have $65K to shell out on a product that has not even been proven to be viable.

The facts are SolarCity acquisition was about saving SolarCity from the looming bankruptcy. The company was $3.4 Billion in debt and losing $6 for every dollar it was bringing in revenue. After all, Sungevity and many other solar provider companies went under.

The whole thing was hardly about solar shingles at all. Some would argue solar shingles were an after thought -- a clever way to save the company in which Musk was heavily invested from drowning.

Solar shingles, at this point, are an unproven product and it may be decades before they become a viable and affordable option for most homeowners.

Solar Panels, on the other hand, have been proven to be viable and they are quite affordable, even without subsidies.

Sunrun panels are highly reliable and will generate power for 25 years. Metal roofing is growing, fast. Solar adoption continues. Most homeowners going solar today go with solar panels, not solar shingles.

Just ask Dow Chemical which closed its solar shingles line not too long ago.

Your whole argument is predicated on the idea that solar shingles are going to kill metal roofing and solar panel market as we know it, but the reality is that there is no viable solar shingle product on the market today. And your assertion that Elon Musk is going to do it with his solar shingles is deeply flawed.
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Old 09-26-2017, 06:47 PM   #28
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertM View Post
................
Your whole argument is predicated on the idea that solar shingles are going to kill metal roofing and solar panel market as we know it,
solar shingles will deeply change the metal roofing market - yes.


Quote:
but the reality is that there is no viable solar shingle product on the market today.
Wrong. In fact there are several.

Quote:
And your assertion that Elon Musk is going to do it with his solar shingles is deeply flawed.
no. not flawed.
My assertion is that its going to be whichever company provides a complete system - from shingles (the easy part) to installation/warranty throughout the product life cycle.

Each time I have mentioned Tesla, I have also mentioned "Chinese" - in fact it may be one, both, or neither. Could be some entirely different player.

Your question was: " What's Next for Metal Roofing and How will it Affect your Roofing Business"

I replied. The answer is; Solar Shingles. They will happen within two years. It will be a juggernaut. A real game changer.

You are hung up on Tesla. I don't know why, nor do I care.
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Old 10-10-2017, 09:07 PM   #29
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


No bro, dude, small town guy, Tesla fanboy or whatever you wanna call yourself, you are the one hung up on Tesla here!

Don't forget, Tesla Solar Roof and Elon Musk, and the might "Chinese" were the sole point of your argument in which you not only expressed your opinion and pooped all over metal roofing, but also insulted people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmallTownGuy View Post
The answer is; Solar Shingles. They will happen within two years. It will be a juggernaut. A real game changer.
Here are some compelling facts: Tesla Solar Roof Narrative Continues To Fall Apart: https://seekingalpha.com/article/411...ues-fall-apart

I am just paying attention to the market and at present Tesla Solar Shingle Roofs are not a viable threat to metal roofing or asphalt roofing business. Not in two years, and probably not in five years.

It's more likely that Tesla solar shingles which is already $4 billion in debt money-bleeding business will meet the same fate as Dow's solar shingles did after blowing through half a billion dollars...

Sure maybe in ten years from now there will be some "Chinese" competitor. Perhaps, Elon Musk will start flying big fanboys like you to Mars in 10 years, too!

For now though, you should probably stop pooping on metal roofing business!

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Old 10-10-2017, 09:08 PM   #30
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


No bro, dude, small town guy, Tesla fanboy or whatever you wanna call yourself, you are the one hung up on Tesla here!

Don't forget, Tesla Solar Roof, Elon Musk, and the mighty "Chinese" were the sole point of your argument in which you not only expressed your opinion and pooped all over metal roofing, but also insulted people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmallTownGuy View Post
Solar Shingles. They will happen within two years. It will be a juggernaut. A real game changer.

Here are some ongoing developments: Tesla Solar Roof Narrative Continues To Fall Apart: https://seekingalpha.com/article/411...ues-fall-apart

I am just paying attention to the market and at present Tesla Solar Shingle Roofs are not a viable threat to metal roofing or asphalt roofing business.

Sure maybe in ten years from now there will be some "Chinese" competitor. Perhaps, Elon Musk will start flying big fanboys like you to Mars in 10 years, too!

For now though, you should probably stop pooping on metal roofing business!


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Old 10-10-2017, 09:54 PM   #31
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Re: What's Next For Metal Roofing And How Will It Affect Your Roofing Business?


Well, this isn't getting anywhere. Closed.

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