Turning In Ins. Fraud

MJW

Lost another job that was a $42,000 claim. Tired of these white collars with illegals under cutting us. Guy told the HO he can cover his deductible and give him $2,000 back. This is insurance fraud. We will be calling the state to report this. Has anyone else done this yet?

I think we should all start turning this crap in.

J-Peffer

He just took food off your plate by playing dirty.

I'd already have made the phone call, I'd turn the home owner in too.

How'd you get the information?

Houston's

How is it fraud? We do it all the time at my friends auto shop?
Dont "flame" me just wanted to know how it was fraud?

joasis

Tell me you are joking? If a quick answer is that the insurance company can afford it better then you or a customer can, then you are already thinking in the theft mode. Now you know why it is illegal, and if it wasn't, it is unethical.

I have had homeowners ask me for the same deal. I give them my price, and that price is the price, I am uninterested in what the insurance settlement is. I also sleep well at night.

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bert0168

Are you serious?

It's fraud because the HO is going to receive a check for an amount from the ins. co to repair his roof. NONE of this money should be pocketed to be used on something else.

It's fraud because the HO accepts the check KNOWING that he was going to get the roof done for less than he was going to get.

It's fraud because the HO and the piece of contractor who is going to do the work are conspiring to defraud the ins. co. out of money by working together to get as much as they can out of the ins. co.

If I were you, I wouldn't be worried about getting "flamed". You better keep what you and your mechanic buddy do to yourselves.

LA_nailer

Before everybody goes off the DEEP end here, you've got to have some background info on how things are done down here in louisiana.

From my experience, almost no one around here, gets any bids from contractors untill after they have their insurance check in their hand. In my 4 years of business, and 2 hurricanes to boot, i've only had 8-9 jobs in which the H/O got a quote from me before they had met with their insurance adjuster.

Now, that being said, if Joe Blow down the road gets a $10,000 check from his insurance and my bid is $9,200, he's not gonna call the insurance comp. back and say, "come back and take this left over money".

With all of this being said, i have NEVER, and will never tell an h/o that i can get them x-amount back after the work is done, that would be fraud. But if a contractors bid is lower than what the H/O had in his hand from the ins. comp. well then that is the contractors fault.

bert0168

OK, that would be different and that may serve the dumb ins. co. right for not getting up front quotes. But as you said, IF the contractor knows this OR conspires with the HO, different ball o' wax.

Houston's

o ok, we never would work with the owner to rip off the ins. co.. he just did the work cheeper in most cases and the owner keeps the extra money.

I guess the laws are diffrent every where.

mattp

I agree it is very wrong and would never do such a thing. But someone please explain this: homeowner get a check for $5000 from insurance, I do his roof for 4800 not knowing the insurance paid more, is he required to return the remaining $200 and if he doesn't is it fraud. By the way my prices are hardly ever under the insurance price.

joasis

It is different because you didn't knowingly set out to alter or juice an estimate for getting the job. Since the only roofing we do is steel, the insurance check is not my concern....I have been asked to write estimates higher then the my actual estimate, and I usually say "you want me to charge you more?"...and refuse. My reputation in our area is far more important.

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MJW

Yes they are, but no one does. They are also supposed to pay their deductible, but most don't.

Houston's

I would never do that.

dougger222

Joe, have you contacted the home owners insurance company yet?

I was told by a "by the books" staff adjuster for the largest insurance company in the nation that the sort of thing that you mentioned although illegal to a certain extent is rarely convicted on charges of fraud. How the adjuster put it is they owe for the damage and they are willing to pay for it but nothing more or nothing twice. What the home owner does with the extra money is there thing.

MJW

Adjusters and insurance companies can be just as shady as anyone. One adjuster told a HO that he did not have to fix his siding or roof as long as he didn't receive the depreciation check. What the didn't tell the HO is that he would no longer have insurance on his siding or roof, being it would not be fixed.
This is why the mortgage companies get involved. They want that house fixed that they have invested in.

Some other adjusters tell the HO's straight out, to get multiple bids, take the cheapest and pocket the remaining money.

Dougger, you are right. This stuff is illegal, but rarely enforced. Sometimes makes me wonder why I buy good materials, do good work, have insurance and a license, or even give a rats arse. I would rather be proud of my work though than proud of the dirty dollar.

genecarp

Insurance companies have been ripping off the public, and the public has been ripping off the insurance companies forever, this will never change.

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dougger222

Last night at my wifes work talked to a customer who promissed me his 40sq 12/12 roof. I talked him into calling out an adjuster to look at his 19 year old Horizon roof and siding with two holes. He told me when his cousins husband came out the look at the siding he asked if he could do the roof too. Story was he's a contractor and very slow with work. The home owner ended up getting a new roof and new siding and walked with $8K in his pocket.

Looking back I should have had him not call his agent and pushed him into getting his roof down the old fashion way, out of pocket.

Don't know of any good contractors who are slow with work right now. In all reality he would have been put off till the Spring. Don't even care to drive by and see how they did. This if the first lead in 3 years from my wife who didn't turn into a job. At least the only time I had in the lead was measuring the roof and faxing an estimate.

747

Its called a kickback.

dinkisdad

The contractor and the HO are in this together. Calling and reporting fraud will be pointless because it's your word against their word. Who's gonna investigate that?

The insurance company could care less because they are paying for what is damaged. Just be glad it worked out that way because if you would've got the job then the HO would be a royal pain in the a--.

If you have a written agreement with the HO for the job and didn't get the job you should sue. Otherwise you're SOL.

Technically if the HO gets the work done for a cheaper price, from a contractor, then yes they are supposed to refund the difference. Again, how many adjusters have the time or the inclination to go and check each individual job to make sure what they paid for got done.

Anyway just my 2 cents worth.

Dave

mickeyco

It's probably not insurance fraud, the insurance company is paying you for the damage that was covered on the policy, you can do what ever you want with the money as long as the roof is returned to insurable quality, unless the policy says otherwise. Now if the estimate was purposefully inflated or has false elements at the homeowners request, both the HO and estimator would be committing a fraud.

I do insurance repairs on my own buildings when I have a claim, and make money on doing them, and the insurance company knows it. They send out an adjuster or I get estimates, they send out a check, I do the work, no fraud at all.


The real problem here is the illegal aliens, they don't have the expenses, insurances and tax bills that all of us have, plus they get a crap load of money from the Government, so they can undercut us, and they will every chance they are given by a cheap homeowner that doesn't care about this country (I'd say, or know better, but I expect citizens to know what's going on in their country).

Report illegal aliens and call your Congressmen and Senators.





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Some people climb mountains. I take out the trash. But we both do it for the same reason.

dbarnes

How do we find out for sure if this is legal or not?

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"Even the once simple contractor mortgage now has so many flavours and styles and variations that it is difficult for people to make a decision."