Starting Number Of Employees

frisco84

Has anyone started there roofing companies with a one man crew ei themselves. I don't trust many people to do my work, so I intended to just stick to my self as the crew. Then hire a couple laborers under the table. That way I can go seeing around till I find people Im comfortable with then offer them a job. Is that wrong? Has anyone ever done anything similar?

tinner666

I'm a One-man crew. If it's too big to handle, I give it to another company I used to work for. When they have a complicated on or a really difficult customer, they give those to me.

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Frank Slate Roof Repairs, Richmond, Va.

MJW

That is a great way to start. Teach everyone yourself and over-see everything.

Ed the Roofer

Your first few posts showed some promise, but if this is how you plan on operating, you will screw yourself royally and deserve it too.

One small accident can cost 1/2 million dollars for medical bills. I know. It happened to one of my employees 3-4 years ago.

Do you have that much laying around to cover such an episode?

Ed

Grumpy

Under the table is usually how it's done in this business, but a great way to lose everything you own when the first mistake happens! I am not an advocate of doing anything illegal. How do you expect to build your business on a shaky foundation? Your business will forever be flawed.

Put out an add, find a guy, train him how you want things done. Put out another add, wash rinse repeat. One at a time though. If you are goign to hire laborers to clean trash or what ever, then consider one of the labor temp services that take care of their own insurance and labor burdens.

PressurePros

The temp service was something I was going to recommend also. They cover everything including WC. I don't know how a roofer in his right mind would consider hiring someone under the table. All guys on ladders, half of them doing death defying s*** or hung over from the night before. Its not worth it.

PS: every guy I have ever hired that has worked for a roofer was paid under the table.

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Ken Fenner
Pressure Washing PA
Roof Cleaning Services PA

PA woodbutcher

I use a couple of guys that carry their own insurance that I use for my roofs, but I really don't doo many....probably 125 squares a year. I use one to strip the roof and another to get clean the mess. I do all my own shingling. When I'm not using them, they do theri own thing. When they need a hand for jobs that they might not have the tools for I sub for them.

Grumpy

...and it's damned hard to find anyone who wants to be paid legit since everyone else pays under the table.

dougger222

Like saying do you want a cheesburger or a steak?

Anybody who wants to better there future will want to pay taxes.

Subbing is a good way to go but then you'll find your subs to be under insured and under qualified. By the hour is good but you need to keep your workers motivated if paying hourly especially if they know what the going rate is by the square.

I've worked on hundreds of roofs solo but my new aproach is work smarter and not harder. Pay good workers good pay and they'll take care of you which in turns takes care of the home owner. Pay your workers bad and they won't be loyal and will do bad work.

It costs me more money to pay my help than to sub to a crew of Mexicans and I'm on the roof on most jobs. The home owners always comment on how nice it was to meet my workers. A worker who's smiling puts a lot of confidence in a home owner.

Just got a call from a guy I've known my whole life. He's buidling a 40sq house and he hired a "roofer" to do his roof at $900 labor. This evening I stopped by the house to see if the job was of interest to me. After looking at the back of the garage which is about 3 square's my father, and I realized it should be torn off and re-done since the rest of the house will be quality. He agreed and now he's going to be paying 2.5 times more in labor but at least it will be done right. Should put new paper over the angled paper too. The "roofer" was fired when he handed the belt back to the home owner and he found his pipe in it. Guess he got so stoned he forgot to take his pipe?

Pretty funny stuff...

Just like a home owner you also need to know who you hire.

Grumpy

That's good news, you've seen the light! I was wonering when it was going to happen and saw the slow progression, but may you damned near did a 180 on the subject. Good for you!

Why didn't the so called roofer have his own belt? LOL. I'd have fired him if he showed up without tools.

MJW

I agree with you doug about paying your guys well. It works out good when you have enough work to keep them busy.

Working smarter and not harder is a saying I hate hearing. There's enough bums walking around with a clip board and a bluetooth phone that think they are contractors. This is when things start to slide down hill.

MJW

LOL Grumpy, talk about a difference in workers here.

Grumpy

Agreed but you can slam evey nail yourself. There comes a time when nature takes over and we slow down, our bodies get tired. You can't work forever especially in roofing which as we all know tears you up quick. Plus there are some jobs that simply can not be done alone and will require a 2nd or 3rd set of hands.

I always say to do what you do well and hire others to compensate for what you don't do well or don't enjoy doing. If you really like the installation aspect then do it, I much prefer the management, sales and customer service side, though I am fully capable of installing when I must. The bottom line is there are guys out there that willl do a job better and faster than me, so I am only a fool when I try to do it myself. Everyone should play to their own talents.

frisco84

I read all the reply's and they are all interesting. As to Ed the Roofers response, you got a point. I've decided to start on small roofs, where I'll be able to work alone for now. When I feel comfortable enough in being legitimate, then maybe I'll do the other idea and find someone to train to my likingand move on to a bit bigger roofs. Besides it is true we can't do it our selves for ever, this job is tough and wears on our bodies fast.

Now a new concern would be wether or not I need to get work men's comp for myself. Though I highly doubt I will sue myself. .

theroofinggod

cover yourself w/a comp policy rated on 10,000.00 wages to start,if you go over you pay more but this allows you to try guys out and be covered in case of problems,as you get larger the policy will expand based on percentages

Ed the Roofer

Where I have a;ways had my W/C policies, they base the amount due on actual audited payroll, which includes "MIS-CLASSIFIED" subcontractors, who are in reality just employees being paid piece work and 1099'd at the end of the year.

If you have $ 20,000.00 in actual payroll, you will wind up paying for the entire gross payed, not just your reported $ 10,000.00 stated.

Our W/C rate is somewheres around 39 points which means that for every $100.00 of gross wages, we owe $ 39.00.

You have to make sure you quote proper bids including your overhead and all labor burdens and collect your monies expeditiously and save it for each payment due date so it does not come as a surprise.

Ed

joasis

I am working on switching up to using only subs....no employees. I am sick of our WC system as my audit progresses...I can hire a crew with insurance to tear off a roof for little more then it costs me to have my guys do it.....and as it is harder to have competent employees with the oil field booming (wages are up for common workers), I am going to ditch the traditional route. My son and I will comprise the future...sub out what we need.

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theroofinggod

it`s 44 per hundred here ed,if you have no employees it works fine,you use guys on try out basis,and if they don`t work out they don`t but doing this you may not pay out more than the 10,000.00 budgeted and paid for.that is a minimum,of course after that you would be audited on employee expenses,but if you budget 2o,ooo.oo and only pay 10,000.00 in wages,my experience is tyhat they will say oh well rather than give it back,if you owe them you`re gonna pay either way!

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"If it`s worth doing.It`s worth doing right!!!

www.ADVANCEDROOFINGNEWYORK.com

buffalonymann

One of the greatest hurdles of growing a business is starting out, and the simple fact is that you need employees to make money for you. From there its a matter of economics, the more employees you have, the more money you will make.

As somebody else mentioned, the cheapest labor is not always the most productive & efficient labor.

My company helps businesses become more productive & efficient by training their employees in skills where they may be lacking, introduce equipment to automate some processes, and negotiate lower prices for raw materials.

We can also help owner/operators to manage their business in a way that allows you to maintain full time skilled employees, even though you may not have full time employment available.