Shingles Hang Over Gutter

robertc65

When it rains hard the water running down my roof will run right past the gutter and onto the ground. My gutters have a plastic mesh cover with an aluminum rail that runs the lenght of the gutter to support the mesh. The shingles appear to have been installed such that they cover almost half of the gutter. In one area I cut the shingles back a bit so I could see inside the gutter. It looks like this would work but It would be a real pain to remove the aluminum rail. If I leave the rail water can run between it and the back of the gutter. Is there a type of roofing tape I could use to seal the end of the shingles to the aluminum rail?

Grumpy

Robert, I see you have other posts, without checking those posts I have to ask if youa re a home owner or contractor. If you are a home owner this is a question for a Do It Yourself forum. Please visit our sister site www.diychatroom.com If you are a contractor asking for help on his own home... then my apologies.

Take pictures.

Thats the problem with all those gutter guards, which you called a mesh gutter. They work excellent under light rains, but in heavy rains it's like the gutters aren't even there. You trade one problem, cleaning the gutters, for another, foundation leaks and landscape wash out. I have very little faith in most gutter guards.

The shingles should overhang into the gutter at least 1" in most cases.

Glasshousebltr

Wow Grump. You push them out an 1"? I've always been taught 1/2inch past ODE. No more, no less, with exception of facia wave.

Bob

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Bob

Grumpy

http://www.certainteed.com/NR/rdonly..._ch12_3Tab.pdf Page #2 Paragraph #2 of Starter Course.

"Make sure there is 1/2" left overhanging both rakes and eaves if drip edge is being used. If you are not using drip edge make the over hang 3/4"."

Then also on page 2 "1st Course" paragraph reads "Make tabs lie flush with the edges of the starter course."


I find that by installing 1" instead of 3/4" it compensates for wavy fascia as you said, but also if the roofers make a 1/4" mistake it's better to be a wee bit too much, than a wee bit too little. Also gutters are almost always installed here in the Chicago area, and drip edge is not a proper gutter flashing, therefore we use the 3/4" method or as I explained above actually 1"

River Rat Dad

Here in good old Ann Arbor, we've actually been busted by a building inspector for having a 1" overhang. Had to go back and shave a 1/4" inch off. I think my knuckles are still bleeding 6 months later...

And what was our "code violation" one may be wondering? There's a catch all clause in the code about manufacturers specs.
Talk about an inspector with too much time on his hands...

Teetorbilt

I have the same problem with a low pitch metal roof. Our afternoon thunderstorms can dump inches per hour, the roof offers no resistance to flow and the low pitch directs the water beyond the gutter.

I've been wondering if these custom gutter businesses can form a gutter that is higher in the front than in the back.

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Grumpy

Very easy, and I've done it many times. In the sheet metal business, there is a saying: If you can draw it, we can bend it.

AaronB.

I do not belleive you should ever have a gutter higher in the front than the back. When downspouts clog (and they all do) water has only one way to go....toward the building. I have solved many leakgae troubles on metal low slope roofs by removing the high faced gutter and installing a lower faced, wider gutter.

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Grumpy

In regards to what Aaron has said, it's total common sense that the water has to go somewhere, and can potentially back up if not over flow. I have already been told that if projecting a straight line completely parrallel with the roof pitch, the front of the gutter should be 1" below that straight line. What I find with metal, though, is that almost every job is different and unique.

In this case perhaps a wider gutter would cath more water than a taller gutter. Or perhaps if installing a taller gutter, some kind of overflows should be installed incase the downspouts do drain. We've done scuppers with overflows, why not gutters too.

robertc65

Thanks Grumpy. I'm not a contractor and really don't fancy ladders much anymore. So unless this was real simple fix I'm not doing it. From what you have mentioned it seems clear to me that the Mesh and Aluminum rail should come out. I would rather clean my gutters than bail water out of the basement. Also it looks as though there is not enough fall in the gutters as water just sits in there. Nothing is clogged it just has no slope to speak of. Do the Gutters have to be removed to create more of a slope. If so I may just want to have them replaced.

Thank you everyone for your comments.

Grumpy

Typically a long length of gutter should be replaced when it comes to repitching only because it's difficult to successfully repitch a long length and keep it looking good. However short 10-15' runs can be easily repitched without repalceing.

Having said that, we charge about the same to repitch as we would to replace and we don't warrant the repairs, so most customers opt for the replacements and the warranty.

Gutters are fairly cheap. Make sure you go with something seamless.

AaronB.

Chalk line.

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Grumpy

Chalk line would require removing the entire gutter to mark your line. If I am doing that why would I put back the old gutter? It's probably going to be a little bit bent up from removal, it's going to take an extra man to hold the gutter so it doesn't just fall to the ground... It's cost prohibitive. I could have the gutters replaced faster, and with new material, by a professional gutter subcontractor for about the same cost, so where is the benefit of repitching?

If I were to repitch a long section, which we have done though we don't like to, it goes something like this... I find the high end and remove some of the fasteners at that end then pull it up and refasten. I then find the low end and remove the fasteners and push down then refasten. I totally agree this is not the best method, but this is how we do it for all the reasons explained in the paragraph above.

karma_carpentry

I just had a callback on a gutter problem. I replace rotted fascia and soffit and rotted rafter tails. I replaced the old gutter pitched about 2" drop in 22'.

Customer says water is coming out where a valley spills into the gutter in a heavy rain. It's the low side of the gutter and also same place where another 8' length gutter drops into it too.

My plan was to bend and rivet a little sheet of aluminum to make a splash guard on the outside of the gutter at that point, and also a splash guard behind the drip edge and into the gutter, laying against the fascia.

Does that sound like a good idea? It doesn't have to be pretty but it has to work.

Grumpy

A splash guard on the outside of the gutter is a good idea assuming the customer doesn't mind the look. What do you mean a splash guard behind the drip edge?

The other thing is, if you are dumping water from an upper roof into a lower roof, make sure the lower downspout is properly sized to handle the flow of water. This may mean installing an additional downspout or enlarging the existing to over sized (3x4).

If a drip edge was installed, T shaped, and not a gutter flashing/apron, L shaped... IMO this is highly improper. Most drip edges have 1 1/2" face and that 1 1/2" is not enough to cover the back of the gutter, especially since by your own admission it is a 2" drop. A typical gutter flashing, L shaped, usually has a 2 1/2" face, however we often custom bend out own for situations where we need to cover more than 2 1/2".