Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach

 
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Old 10-07-2010, 05:42 AM   #1
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Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I need some suggestions as to how to address a 5V tin roof at a client's beach house. First, a little general information: house faces south which is directly within one house of ocean; house is clerestory and a duplex with the flashing detail facing south; the wall below the lower roof shows a moisture content of 15%-20% with some areas a little bit higher, the side wall shows less than 10%; the adjoining duplex has the same detail but I have not gone inside to confirm moisture content; the flashing was put down with mastic but mastic has come out and dried out; the roof/renovation was done about 6-7 years ago. One other situation is excessive rusting of the screws. I know this is a beach house so it is going to happen.

The first picture is the overall situation, the second picture is under the flashing, the third picture is a sample of mastic coming out from under flashing.

My thinking is to strip the siding down and check all details. Then reattached the flashing to the flat roof with new mastic but this time screw it down in several places to make sure it has contact all the way down. Then caulk with NP 1 to the roof. The put the siding back up sealing up any gaps. I am also thinking about extending the peel and seal that I just wrapped the roof edge with down to the lower roof prior to reinstallation of lower roof flashing. That way the wall will be completely sealed in some form or fashion.

As most of the contractors around the beach know, rain does not come straight down at the beach it goes sideways. So I have to take in account that.

Thoughts anyone?
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Screws in 5V tin roof at beach-img_2964.jpg   Screws in 5V tin roof at beach-img_3002.jpg   Screws in 5V tin roof at beach-img_6109.jpg  
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Old 10-07-2010, 05:47 AM   #2
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I have a client who has a house at the beach. He had the roof/renovation done several years ago. The screws are rusting pretty bad and of course it is streaking the roof. The question is should I replace all of the screws or just leave them alone? I am afraid that that it is going to rust out and I will not be able to go back in the same hole. Below is a picture of the screws. This is typical for both sides of this duplex. There is some rusting of the panels but I think from something else but I feel that I need to address the screws.

I am already redoing some flashing details at the top and bottom of a clerestory on this house so I figured this may be good time. I need the work but I do not want to do it just for that. I want to do it right as the client has been good to me. I also want to help him look out for his property.
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Old 10-07-2010, 06:43 AM   #3
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


usually you would have a neoprene closure sealed top and bottom with butyl tape, or an asphalt impregnated expanding foam tape in that area,and screw the endwall flashing to every rib


looks like those windows with the built in j,probably a reverse lap in the housewrap by them somewhere
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Old 10-07-2010, 08:06 AM   #4
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I haven't screwed the high points of metal roofing for over 20 years...

Replace the screws with one size larger diameter and a longer screw.
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Old 10-07-2010, 08:58 AM   #5
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


Looking at that photograph and the side-view photograph in your other related thread, there appears to be some major electrolysis going on with the sheet metal roofing being the consumable metal.

Right now I think if you willy nilly remove and replace screws, you may end up with a bunch of big holes in your clients roof. It is possible that there just is not enough "meat" left after the corrosion.

I think you need to find out what material and manufacturer was used on the roof, aw well as the fasteners. Contact the rep for the material, and see what kind of attachment system is recommended under the conditions of original construction, as well as his recommendations for repair.

I believe presently that your clients may have reason to pursue actions against the roofer and roofing manufacturer. I do not believe you should alter this construction at this point, because any alterations by you or the owner may weaken potential claims.

That said, you do have a responsibility to lessen further damage.

Whatever you do, document everything very well.
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Old 10-07-2010, 05:41 PM   #6
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I'd tell them that even though seven years seems like a short life for a metal roof, that kind of roofing isn't particularly meant for residential use in the first place, and that if it's ruining the wall (of what I assume is a high dollar property) then it has served its useful life and needs to be replaced.

OTOH, like Tom said it's probably the window anyway.
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Old 10-07-2010, 06:08 PM   #7
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


The owner has said in so many words that he was not too happy with the job. He liked the guy but he is concerned. The metal flashing at the top that I am redoing now is rusted pretty bad. In fact, one spot actually rusted through. I had to take another pc of galvanized and seal over it. It has held great but the rest of the details are bad.

I am going to continue with the repair that I made to the top. i am leaning to leaving the screws alone myself right now. We all know 5V is the farmers choice of roofing. I agree that it is intended to be used on storage buildings and barns. I do not like trying to screw in a ridge either. I have put up many metal buildings and we always screwed into the flat.

The metal panels look good right now but I am concerned with the screws. I guess I will tell him what is going on but right now we need to leave it alone. And in the future we need to plan on replacing it. I can get regular rib type roof metal panels if that is what he wants or go to shingles. His choice.
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Old 10-07-2010, 06:10 PM   #8
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I think I am going to just strip it down so that I can check the wall and then seal it like I did the top. That will probably buy him some more time. Of course unless he wants to replace it now. Which would make me a happy camper.
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Old 10-07-2010, 06:51 PM   #9
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


i can't believe i type the same thing i typed this morning,sorry mitch im getting old....wow
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Old 10-07-2010, 07:15 PM   #10
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I am going to find out. This is a one half of a duplex. The owner and the owner next door doubled their respective side about 6-7 years ago. It had plywood siding. It looks like they covered it with something like Tyvek and then put tar paper on top of that and then installed vinyl imitation shake siding. I think you are right about the windows. There are four up there but it looks like only one is leaking.

I am going to take the siding off and look at the details soon.
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Old 10-07-2010, 07:18 PM   #11
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


Merged this thread with your other one on the same subject, Mitch.

First try at this as a new mod--if this upsets anyone's applecart, let me know.
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Old 10-07-2010, 07:21 PM   #12
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


easy Tin,let Lone do the heavy work,he's just a kid
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Old 10-07-2010, 09:12 PM   #13
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


Galvalume that close to the ocean will fail just like what it is doing from the salt spray... You can Ospho the rust and coat the screw with a metal rehab system for a temp. repair but if they want to stay metal they need to pony up to an aluminum Kynar painted standing seam panel....just multiply what ever it cost them to do the roof the first time by about 4 or 5... or else break out the silver coat and dab the screws about once or twice a year...
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Old 10-08-2010, 07:08 AM   #14
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I have sent my report to him. If he decides to change I am pretty sure it will be shingles.
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Old 10-08-2010, 07:10 AM   #15
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


OK with me on the merge. Good job.
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Old 10-09-2010, 01:38 PM   #16
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


I sent my response to the client at the beach. He has responded and told me to proceed with my recommendations and suggestions. I will opening up the wall and sealing it with peel and stick as well as reflashing the windows. Of course I will be inspecting every portion of the wall including the flashings.

I explained to him about the roof and the screws and at this point we will probably leave it alone and keep a close eye on it. I may do what one suggestion was to clean and do some minor painting around the screws.

I will document what I see and repost that information. In the meantime I have some other projects that I need to do as well as go to his main home and do some work there. So...score another one for me.
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Old 10-09-2010, 02:16 PM   #17
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


nice Mitch,need the pics of what you find
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Old 10-09-2010, 08:22 PM   #18
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


Mitch you asked for suggestions so I'm going to give you one completely out side the box,we know about the galvanic series and the Electrochemical process OK.
Here are two links to help any one understand this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_series/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_corrosion
My back ground is originally in the marine industry and when building a steel fishing boat,yacht or a supper tanker the same process for protection was always used.
Think about this, these are steel craft in a totally hostile environment but the guys who Design and build them understand the environment and the galvanic series.
Steel is low down on the list of noble and least noble metals but zinc is even lower on the list and zinc sacrificial anodes are always fastened to the hull of the craft.The zinc which would corrode in the environment any way, corrodes at a much accelerated rate and in the Electrochemical process protects the steel that it is fastened to.
So how does this help you in your situation well if you spoke to the client and said you wanted to try a process that could check the corrosion of his roof I think he would jump at it.
You could pick up a sacrificial anode at any marina or they could order you one,you could then fasten it to the roof and as you say your going to keep an eye on it any way see how it effects the area around the anode and the rest of the roof.
What have you got to lose nothing what have you got to win "knowledge" and knowledge is worth money and could help you on another project.
Because you would be taking Knowledge from one industry and trying to transfer it to another and if you do take it on, come back and tell us how it went on we could all be gaining knowledge now that would be something.
Best of luck. billy.
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Old 10-09-2010, 11:00 PM   #19
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Re: Screws In 5V Tin Roof At Beach


Quote:
Originally Posted by billy d View Post
Mitch you asked for suggestions so I'm going to give you one completely out side the box,we know about the galvanic series and the Electrochemical process OK.
Here are two links to help any one understand this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_series/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_corrosion
My back ground is originally in the marine industry and when building a steel fishing boat,yacht or a supper tanker the same process for protection was always used.
Think about this, these are steel craft in a totally hostile environment but the guys who Design and build them understand the environment and the galvanic series.
Steel is low down on the list of noble and least noble metals but zinc is even lower on the list and zinc sacrificial anodes are always fastened to the hull of the craft.The zinc which would corrode in the environment any way, corrodes at a much accelerated rate and in the Electrochemical process protects the steel that it is fastened to.
So how does this help you in your situation well if you spoke to the client and said you wanted to try a process that could check the corrosion of his roof I think he would jump at it.
You could pick up a sacrificial anode at any marina or they could order you one,you could then fasten it to the roof and as you say your going to keep an eye on it any way see how it effects the area around the anode and the rest of the roof.
What have you got to lose nothing what have you got to win "knowledge" and knowledge is worth money and could help you on another project.
Because you would be taking Knowledge from one industry and trying to transfer it to another and if you do take it on, come back and tell us how it went on we could all be gaining knowledge now that would be something.
Best of luck. billy.
Thanks Billy. That is excellent advice. I will check some of the local marine supply yards and see what they have. I did not put this roof on originally. I still question this application in the first place. The duplex owner next door only had the metal installed on the lower roof. He put shingles on the upper roof. My client had the whole roof done with metal.

Should I do anything to the present screws or roof prior to installing the anode?

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